Do you want to discuss boring politics? (53 Viewers)

[clint van damme]

Because they don't want to vote for identity politics , they don't want to vote for the people that keep telling them how bad they are and how privileged they are , they don't want to align themselves with all the middle class activists on social media that call them bigoted Gammon flag shaggers day in day out ...

You keep asking but it's already been said ..

Don't upset the people whose votes you need to win

Most people I know cant stand Labour and many of them used to vote for them religiously

but you don't have to vote, it's not compulsory.
I keep telling you, I accept your criticism of Labour, I can't understand why working class people vote tory.
Do you think identity politics is worse than rinsing the public purse of billions?

 

---

[Evo1883]

but you don't have to vote, it's not compulsory.
I keep telling you, I accept your criticism of Labour, I can't understand why working class people vote tory.
Do you think identity politics is worse than rinsing the public purse of billions?

Labour are shit clint ...many have moved on and don't care about them anymore .

The ones left are hanging on by a thread

They have to be shit if the Tories are that bad but keep winning

 

[clint van damme]

Labour are shit clint ...many have moved on and don't care about them anymore .

The ones left are hanging on by a thread

They have to be shit if the Tories are that bad but keep winning

everyone keeps avoiding my question, it's like the brexit thread, I'll leave it there.

 

[Evo1883]

everyone keeps avoiding my question, it's like the brexit thread, I'll leave it there.

I don't feel any different today than I did 12 years ago ...bills are still too high , my wages are not much different and I can still see a doctor fast , my kids school is doing well etc etc etc ..

Where am I being severely hampered by the Tories as a working class man

 

[Grendel]

Can't you answer the question?
Labour does not appeal to the working class snymore, but why do they vote tory?

Because they want aspiration not drudgery

 

[Skybluefaz]

I don't feel any different today than I did 12 years ago ...bills are still too high , my wages are not much different and I can still see a doctor fast , my kids school is doing well etc etc etc ..

Where am I being severely hampered by the Tories as a working class man

Easier to find a food bank under Tory rule I suppose. Every cloud.

 

[Evo1883]

Easier to find a food bank under Tory rule I suppose. Every cloud.

Me and my missus have been through some exceptionally difficult times financially ..
And we used a food bank ONCE under a LABOUR government after we'd lost our house as it was repossessed

Labour are no fucking saints .

Also try getting rehoused under this Labour Council, you ain't got a fucking chance they scrapped the waiting list in favour of a banding system that favours everybody but normal hard working people and good families.

Yet I still vote for them because tradition etc etc

 

[clint van damme]

Because they want aspiration not drudgery

nah. That's not it.
Not saying people aren't aspirational but that's not what the tories offer.

 

[clint van damme]

Because these discussions tend to go around and round in circles, with well-made points (e.g. round identity politics and brexit) simply not responded to, and where they are there is the well-honed use of contradiction, responding to tone, and ad hominems, with a nice bit of condescension and passive-aggressiveness tossed into the mix.

And in the vacuum that's created, we get the juvenile posts about the working class being a bunch of racist knobs.

come on mate, you're clearly a clever guy.
You're telling me why people have had enough of Labour, I'll accept all of it, but if they've had enough of the 'elite' and the 'establishment', why do they think that someone like Duncan Smith or Rees Mogg has their interests at heart?
You can't just keep saying because people keep calling the working class racist. What do the tories offer?

 

[Evo1883]

There's no point.

Moving on

 

[Grendel]

nah. That's not it.
Not saying people aren't aspirational but that's not what the tories offer.

Do Labour offer working classes an aspiration to middle class private schools for their children and big holidays it is that just for the Labour politicians and union leaders? If everyone achieved this who would vote for Labour? Think about it

 

[Evo1883]

come on mate, you're clearly a clever guy.
You're telling me why people have had enough of Labour, I'll accept all of it, but if they've had enough of the 'elite' and the 'establishment', why do they think that someone like Duncan Smith or Rees Mogg has their interests at heart?
You can't just keep saying because people keep calling the working class racist. What do the tories offer?

Why do you keep voting Labour when it's membership is something like 70% middle class and it's MPs are all rich as fuck like the Tories too?

What's the massive difference here in 2021

It's hardly anti establishment itself

 

[clint van damme]

Why do you keep voting Labour when it's membership is something like 70% middle class and it's MPs are all rich as fuck like the Tories too?

to be brief, we've had austerity, which is a political ideology not an economic strategy, which has been disastrous, we've seen opportunist cunts take advantage of covid to rinse the public purse, (37 billion track and trace, come on, wake up for fucks sake), I 'm hoping for something different.
I'm personally better off under the tories but I don't think going forward my kids, or more importantly, society will be.

 

[Evo1883]

to be brief, we've had austerity, which is a political ideology not an economic strategy, which has been disastrous, we've seen opportunist cunts take advantage of covid to rinse the public purse, (37 billion track and trace, come on, wake up for fucks sake), I 'm hoping for something different.
I'm personally better off under the tories but I don't think going forward my kids, or more importantly, society will be.

I don't care either way , I question myself when I slag them off and still vote for them .

I understand totally why people don't, working class or not

 

[Grendel]

to be brief, we've had austerity, which is a political ideology not an economic strategy, which has been disastrous, we've seen opportunist cunts take advantage of covid to rinse the public purse, (37 billion track and trace, come on, wake up for fucks sake), I 'm hoping for something different.
I'm personally better off under the tories but I don't think going forward my kids, or more importantly, society will be.

If you were from a working class background worked colloidal hours to get a big house the big car the private education for your children would the Labour Party shake your hand and encourage this ambition?

 

[clint van damme]

If you were from a working class background worked colloidal hours to get a big house the big car the private education for your children would the Labour Party shake your hand and encourage this ambition?

Do you think the tories encourage working class aspiration?

Because I don't think they do.
I Spent 15 years working stupid hours, didn't get lthe big car or house or private education for the kids but I've done ok. But I think that's despite the tories not because of them.

 

[PVA]

Clint has asked about 15 times and no one can answer (or chooses not to).

 

[Evo1883]

People have answered clint , several times

Youre choosing to not listen

If people lives aren't dramatically effected by this tory government on a personal level , as people's attitudes have shifted from the collective to the individual , then all you've got left is wether People like you or not.

And People clearly don't dislike the tories as much as they dislike Labour .

It's In black and white

 

[PVA]

No they haven't.

All they've given is reasons why Labour are crap or reasons not to vote Labour, which is fine but not the question being asked.

 

[Grendel]

Do you think the tories encourage working class aspiration?

Because I don't think they do.
I Spent 15 years working stupid hours, didn't get lthe big car or house or private education for the kids but I've done ok. But I think that's despite the tories not because of them.

Er you’ve avoided the question

 

[Evo1883]

No they haven't.

All they've given is reasons why Labour are crap or reasons not to vote Labour, which is fine but not the question being asked.

This is so frustrating , this is exactly how I think labour MPs talk amongst themselves
.

"I don't get it David , they can't stand the things we say or do , why won't they vote for us , what do the tories offer "

Honestly it's mental

They don't offer you , it's as simple as that

 

[PVA]

This is so frustrating , this is exactly how I think labour MPs talk amongst themselves
.

"I don't get it David , they can't stand the things we say or do , why won't they vote for us , what do the tories offer "

Honestly it's mental

They don't offer you , it's as simple as that

Are you going to answer the question or not?

If you can't then just say, it's fine.

 

[Evo1883]

Are you going to answer the question or not?

I have what the actual fuck is wrong with you

 

[clint van damme]

Er you’ve avoided the question

Not really, I'd admire aspiration, I think, and hope, Labour do, I don't think the tories encourage it in the working class.

I think they applaud coruption like Matt Hancock and his family rinsing the public purse in a crisis.

 

[Grendel]

Are you going to answer the question or not?

Tories by a landslide - the answer you need to get used to

 

[clint van damme]

Tories by a landslide - the answer you need to get used to

That's not an answer as to why.

 

[Grendel]

Not really, I'd admire aspiration, I think, and hope, Labour do, I don't think the tories encourage it in the working class.

I think they applaud coruption like Matt Hancock and his family rinsing the public purse in a crisis.

The Blair government was mired in corruption

 

[Evo1883]

That's not an answer as to why.

Because they'd rather vote for anybody but you ... that's why

 

[PVA]

I have what the actual fuck is wrong with you

You've just repeated time and time again what you don't like about Labour.

You haven't said what's so appealing about the tories other than they're not Labour and you're no worse off than you were 12 years ago

 

[PVA]

Tories by a landslide - the answer you need to get used to

So you can't answer it either, cool.

 

[Evo1883]

You've just repeated time and time again what you don't like about Labour.

You haven't said what's so appealing about the tories other than they're not Labour and you're no worse off than you were 12 years ago

OK here's a question .

Why do Labour keep losing if the tories are so bad , and why are the working class voting for them in their droves if Labour offer them more

 

[clint van damme]

Because they'd rather vote for anybody but you ... that's why

Me? I'm not a politician. Weird answer

 

[PVA]

OK here's a question .

Why do Labour keep losing if the tories are so bad , and why are the working class voting for them in their droves if Labour offer them more

Still haven't answered the question...

 

[Evo1883]

Me? I'm not a politician. Weird answer

I was referring to you as in Labour...not you particularly clint mate ffs

 

[clint van damme]

OK here's a question .

Why do Labour keep losing if the tories are so bad , and why are the working class voting for them in their droves if Labour offer them more

You've literally just asked the question I've asked at least half-dozen times.