Grendel
Well-Known Member
20%? Thats the same amount of the population that voted Labour
Do you want to discuss boring politics? (69 Viewers)
- Thread starter mrtrench
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20%? Thats the same amount of the population that voted Labour
Earlsdon_Skyblue1
Well-Known Member
Are you drunk? You can't even write properly and you've gone into full on leftie mode.
'Oh no, maybe he has a point. Quick, let's pull out the racism card and shut it down before I get more humiliated'.
What an utterly embarrasing post.
I’ve said before when I was involved in making pay decisions, we’d give inflationary for people just doing their job and above inflation for those going above and beyond (meeting or exceeding objectives and goals). Less than inflation/no payrise if people arent performing or delivering what was expected.
I agree with some unions and their conduct, others I don’t. It’s like I agree with how some people run businesses/organisations and others I don’t.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
What does Two Tier Kier mean? Because I was under the impression it means racists get arrested but asylum seekers don’t. Which is clearly bollocks. Everything is about asylum seekers with you lot. Get outside. Touch grass. Most people aren’t this obsessed.
sorry I’m not editing my posts. You’ll just have to deal I guess.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Lets see what the BMA members say.
My bonus is linked to my performance objectives. Not my base pay. I’ve never worked a job where they cut your pay if you don’t meet performance targets. Seems ghastly.
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
The Cameron government thought little about putting people into poverty in the name of saving a few pennies.
I’ve never worked anywhere where pay has been cut but if you’re not doing your job then why should you get a pay rise ?
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
If you don’t get CoL rise your pay has been cut.
Do these businesses call up the electricity supplier and demand better electricity before paying inflationary cost rises there too?
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Isn’t it estimated around 2 million pensioners will be dragged into fuel poverty to save the same money Starmer is spending on arming Ukraine “for as long as it takes”
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Which I find objectionable also
eastwoodsdustman
Well-Known Member
You say its for Ukraine. Most say its to cover the train drivers pay rise.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Well it seems they need it or they will go cold in the winter - so I guess Ukraine and they are more important. Still if a few old people die in the cold at least it will save some of the NHS black hole
Strange analogy but in response if my electricity supply kept cutting off I wouldn’t pay my bill or would expect a discount. If the service was poor I would move to a different electricity supplier.
As I said above, I get it, people on here agree with all unions and all their actions. Fair enough but I don’t. There’s one thing protecting members and making sure conditions are acceptable (100% what unions should do) but I’ve posted some of the suggested changes to train drivers conditions before and many were hardly workhouse rules as I said at the time. BMA have also done stuff I don’t agree with
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Didn’t a Tory minister admit that it would have cost the public less to agree to the union’s pay claim instead of carrying out a strike campaign? Just that they decided not to give other unions ‘encouragement’.
Grendel
Well-Known Member
It’s very common for private sector pay negotiations to include certain agreements - it makes me laugh that public sector unions refuse on occasions compulsory redundancies. Something private sector could never promise.
Of course it works. They strike if they’re not happy. My issue is does it improve the service and who ends up paying
Earlsdon_Skyblue1
Well-Known Member
Mate, you're all over the place. How can you not see a double standard going on? Pete is liking your posts, which just says it all. Mr Keir Starmer: 'I won't tolerate the break down of law and order'...
We've just had Notting Hill Carnival (the latest iteration) which has been a complete shit show. He's been completely silent, about as missing on this as you and your lefty band of fanatics on the stabbing thread after the last few islamic attacks.
I'm not the one that needs to go outside. It might not be 2014 but you are acting as if you get your benchmarks from reddit. keep going if you want, but it's embarrasing.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
They hardly had a ringing endorsement to begin with in terms of the popular vote, and even those that did vote for them did so in many cases as the worst of a bad bunch.
fernandopartridge
Well-Known Member
Why should there be any condition to maintaining your pay with inflation?
Grendel
Well-Known Member
He said the Notting Hill stabbing could be gang related - they weren’t - but even if they were I wasn’t sure what point he was trying to make
Grendel
Well-Known Member
When inflation is very high many companies have a choice to offer below and preserve the workforce or sacrifice some workers. The car industry was destroyed in the late 70’s when ironically a Labour government negotiated a 5% pay freeze with private sector unions. The unions broke ranks and Vauxhall workers demanded 17%. The industry never recovered - the winter of discontent began
An example of a condition could’ve been you don’t strike if you get at least inflationary pay rises for the next x years ? Junior doctors could currently strike next year even if they are offered an inflation pay rise
Also, this is public money, why wouldn’t everyone want things to improve if it was possible and not detrimental to the individuals ?
ps do people even know that he BMA voted to limit/restrict the amount of medical students in 2008 ?!
BMA meeting: Doctors vote to limit number of medical students
Delegates at the annual BMA conference voted by a narrow majority to restrict the number of places at medical schools to avoid “overproduction of doctors with limited career opportunities.” They also agreed on a complete ban on opening new medical schools. David Sochart, from Manchester and...
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
We have some pretty stringent anti union laws which have accumulated over a period of decades and are aimed at obstructing the rights to organise, collectively bargain, and yes go on strike.
Ask yourself why it is that there has been such an attack on these rights and that may explain why I tend to sympathise with the unions more often than not. Not always though.
MalcSB
Well-Known Member
No, he’s just a bare faced liar with zero saving graces.
MalcSB
Well-Known Member
Near in mind that
(a) a note had been left saying there was no money left
(b) the Office for Budget Responsibility haven’t been established
So it probably was worse than he thought. Labour simply don’t have that excuse.
MalcSB
Well-Known Member
I don’t know how I have resisted calling you a twat for so long, but I have managed it.
MalcSB
Well-Known Member
On that basis, god knows how low his approval rating would have been without the riots,
Brighton Sky Blue
Well-Known Member
Even if that’s true, it puts him on a par with the last 3 of his predecessors.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
Its not a strange analogy. Inflation affects all inputs to a business. Be it energy, wood and metal, or Human Resources. But we decide it’s easier to bully a person into lower wages than bully a supplier into lower prices.
Pay should keep up with inflation as the most basic level, otherwise you are signalling that the job isn’t as important as it was.
For Doctors and Teachers in particular that’s lead to a staffing shortage as the job market responds to that signal.
The Cameron/Osborne approach was to pretend you could just not do stuff. Don’t build any infrastructure. Don’t keep pay up with inflation. And surprise surprise it all came falling down around them.
The so called worst examples, and actually ones I have the most sympathy with the right with, train drivers I’ve just shown haven’t had their wages rise by inflation in the last 13 years. So even them with their ridiculous tactics are falling behind. And still people are moaning and wanting their pay cut more.
Public sector employees can’t negotiate individually. Budgets are set by government. They can only get paid what the government agrees, and the government is far worse than most employers at paying a fair wage. Collective bargaining is the only option to prevent political pressures from cutting wages and with it demand from the economy.
MalcSB
Well-Known Member
It was less than that as it was 20% of the electorate that voted Labour, not 20% of the population.
I may be wrong of course as I am thick.
shmmeee
Well-Known Member
If you think the people who have gone from supportive of Starmer to not are the far right I have a bridge to sell you.
MalcSB
Well-Known Member
The BMA have suggested to the “junior doctors” that they should accept this offer and bank it, and then be prepared for more industrial action next year.
If you want to see jobs which can cut pay for not meeting performance targets, look at Agenda for Change (NHS) Band 9 top of scale posts.