Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (111 Viewers)

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Their contract does seem to state the can get UK produced vaccines if clause 5.4 is triggered which the can't produce them at EU sites.

I can see why they are annoyed at AZ and sadly it's normal people who will have to pay.

They have the right to access UK produced vaccines but nowhere does it say they have the right to receive UK produced vaccines ahead of other people who've ordered first. It's not 'first dibs' on vaccine produced in the UK or a 'fastpass' to beat queues at a theme park. It's a fallback option to try and reduce their waiting time. It doesn't give them preferential treatment.

 

---

[Brighton Sky Blue]

No it's not

It clearly states it

This does not state they have the right to seize products from the sites ordered ahead of them by another country.

 

[chiefdave]

They have the right to access UK produced vaccines but nowhere does it say they have the right to receive UK produced vaccines ahead of other people who've ordered first. It's not 'first dibs' on vaccine produced in the UK or a 'fastpass' to beat queues at a theme park. It's a fallback option to try and reduce their waiting time. It doesn't give them preferential treatment.

This does not state they have the right to seize products from the sites ordered ahead of them by another country.

That was going to be my question. Obviously I'm not a lawyer but I can't see where that says they can jump the queue ahead of those who ordered months before them.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

That was going to be my question. Obviously I'm not a lawyer but I can't see where that says they can jump the queue ahead of those who ordered months before them.

They will also be actively trying to fix the issues at the EU sites, they have no incentive for under supplying

 

[fernandopartridge]

Just looking at the APA between the EC and AZ. has the EC / member states (who have not yet approved the vaccine) fulfilled the obligation to make "best reasonable efforts" given that most have not licensed the vaccine. The contract came into effect on 27 August 2020.

Has the EC delivered the Binding Allocation to AZ?

 

[fernandopartridge]

Has each member state delivered an Order Form?

 

[David O'Day]

1 thing we can agree on it is a badly worded contract that the lawyers who wrote it up need speaking to.

So anyway the only best intentions clause seems to be on manufacturing the vaccine in the EU.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

This is more how it looks to me. They can’t get their own rollout in order and are after a scapegoat

The whole thing has been the EU looking for a scapegoat to be honest. The bullying tactics which includes the raiding the AstraZeneca sites was shameful really, you could see the writing was on the wall when Pascal Soriot explained the whole concept of best efforts.

Glad we are absolutely nothing to do with it.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

The whole thing has been the EU looking for a scapegoat to be honest. The bullying tactics which includes the raiding the AstraZeneca sites was shameful really, you could see the writing was on the wall when Pascal Soriot explained the whole concept of best efforts.

Glad we are absolutely nothing to do with it.

We may yet be if they try to block Pfizer exports to here.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

We may yet be if they try to block Pfizer exports to here.

I think their lashing out has been caught out here, so I'm hopeful they don't try that approach.

Needs some calm heads and some adults right now.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

10000 Coventry kids are in school at the moment. Last lockdown the average was 800 per day. It 12x higher this lockdown.

Wow

 

[chiefdave]

This is from twitter so no guarantees to its accuracy but it seems this comes under Belgian law and they have a thing called inspanningsverplichting which says best efforts shall not constitute an obligation or guarantee commitment and there is no liability.

 

[chiefdave]

10000 Coventry kids are in school at the moment. Last lockdown the average was 800 per day. It 12x higher this lockdown.

Wow

Same with offices. Way more people in than last time. There's an article on the BBC site about this today.

The data showed there were more than 500 outbreaks, or suspected outbreaks, in offices in the second half of 2020 - more than in supermarkets, construction sites, warehouses, restaurants and cafes combined.

Covid: Data shows outbreaks in England's offices in lockdown

Under England's lockdown rules, in force since 6 January, people should work from home if they can.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

10000 Coventry kids are in school at the moment. Last lockdown the average was 800 per day. It 12x higher this lockdown.

Wow

Amazing how eager some are to offload their children during a time like this

 

[SBT]

J&J single-shot vaccine results are out:

* 66% effective
* 85% effective against severe disease

I'd have to hear what the experts say before weighing in about whether this is brilliant, a disaster, or somewhere in between. But clearly there's a huge range of efficacy across the various vaccines.

 

[jordan210]

If anyone has the Eu pdf. If you open it in adobe for example and show book marks. It shows some of the information that has been blacked out

 

[It’sabatch87]

The EU are a shambles,It’ll all come down like a pack of cards.
Just said on radio 2 Jeremy vine show a journalist from German news outlet Bild saying German,French and Dutch foreign ministers agreed to sorting enough vaccines out but van der leyen said no Brussels will sort it.
All three furious at Brussels dragging their feet so slow.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Imagine if hundreds of thousands of kids wanted to?

Covid-hit pupils 'should be allowed to repeat a year'

Education think-tank says pupils should have the right to repeat the school year after Covid disruption.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Imagine if hundreds of thousands of kids wanted to?

Covid-hit pupils 'should be allowed to repeat a year'

Education think-tank says pupils should have the right to repeat the school year after Covid disruption.

www.bbc.co.uk

Another ringing endorsement of the efforts of the teaching profession

 

[jimmyhillsfanclub]

Amazing how eager some are to offload their children during a time like this

I'm sure many of those would prefer to be sat home with their kids doing a few zoom meetings, but have no choice but to go out to work......

....that said, I am aware of a few parents at my own kids school who are taking the piss with regards definitions of key worker status etc.

...lockdown-lite innit.....and so we now celebrate 25k+ new daily infections like its a cracking result....

Meanwhile up here the north-west ambulance service has put in a formal request for the Army to help.....

 

[fernandopartridge]

The EU making a fool of themselves imo.

The EU are a shambles,It’ll all come down like a pack of cards.
Just said on radio 2 Jeremy vine show a journalist from German news outlet Bild saying German,French and Dutch foreign ministers agreed to sorting enough vaccines out but van der leyen said no Brussels will sort it.
All three furious at Brussels dragging their feet so slow.

The EU are making cunts of themselves it seems, but none of that other shite makes any sense. All the member states signed up to the bulk procurement, they didn't have to and weren't forced to.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I'm sure many of those would prefer to be sat home with their kids doing a few zoom meetings, but have no choice but to go out to work......

....that said, I am aware of a few parents at my own kids school who are taking the piss with regards definitions of key worker status etc.

...lockdown-lite innit.....and so we now celebrate 25k+ new daily infections like its a cracking result....

Meanwhile up here the north-west ambulance service has put in a formal request for the Army to help.....

It’s more those just taking the piss I have issue with than those still being asked to go in by their employers even if not necessary

 

[fernandopartridge]

The EC / AZ contract defines "Good Manufacturing Practices" as being in accordance with various EU directives. Now we're post Brexit, I wonder whether the UK contract states the same or whether it refers to equivalent UK legislation. If so, AZ may argue that production in the UK plans for UK recipients is not in accordance with the terms of the EC contract, so couldn't possibly be distributed there.

 

[CCFCSteve]

Got to agree with SBD, Fernando, Dave and BSB on this and was going to raise the same point. The EU may well have right to the supplies manufactured in the UK, but if we ordered first and by three months (and approved the vaccine a month ago), how can the EU justify receiving UK manufactured stock ahead of us ? The EU appear to forget we have plenty of administering capacity but are also being held back by supply

If anything, as we pre ordered and approved way ahead of the EU we should be pushing for the EU manufactured supplies of the AZ vaccine to come to the UK first (and Pfizer’s for that matter), if we have shortfalls/unfulfilled capacity !!!

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Got to agree with SBD, Fernando, Dave and BSB on this and was going to raise the same point. The EU may well have right to the supplies manufactured in the UK, but if we ordered first and by three months (and approved the vaccine a month ago), how can the EU justify receiving UK manufactured stock ahead of us ? The EU appear to forget we have plenty of administering capacity but are also being held back by supply

If anything, as we pre ordered and approved way ahead of the EU we should be pushing for the EU manufactured supplies of the AZ vaccine to come to the UK first (and Pfizer’s for that matter), if we have shortfalls/unfulfilled capacity !!!

Do we know when Novavax will enter production?

 

[Grendel]

This is classic eu federalism

Every member is straight armed into agreeing an en bloc decision and that decision will always then be there to benefit the strong nations in the cartel and the weaker ones are just told to stand at the back of the queue and be pummelled into submission

Still morons like Tony Robinson the other day were still slobbering over the EU and saying it’s not fair they are missing out as they care more about their citizens than rush through a vaccine that may have issues with it

It was then revealed he’d already had the vaccine

 

[fernandopartridge]

This is classic eu federalism

Every member is straight armed into agreeing an en bloc decision and that decision will always then be there to benefit the strong nations in the cartel and the weaker ones are just told to stand at the back of the queue and be pummelled into submission

Still morons like Tony Robinson the other day were still slobbering over the EU and saying it’s not fair they are missing out as they care more about their citizens than rush through a vaccine that may have issues with it

It was then revealed he’d already had the vaccine

He's a wanker

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

This is classic eu federalism

Every member is straight armed into agreeing an en bloc decision and that decision will always then be there to benefit the strong nations in the cartel and the weaker ones are just told to stand at the back of the queue and be pummelled into submission

Still morons like Tony Robinson the other day were still slobbering over the EU and saying it’s not fair they are missing out as they care more about their citizens than rush through a vaccine that may have issues with it

It was then revealed he’d already had the vaccine

While I agree on Robinson you do realise any EU state can give emergency approval for any vaccine? Like we did while under their rules?

 

[Grendel]

While I agree on Robinson you do realise any EU state can give emergency approval for any vaccine? Like we did while under their rules?

As I said there is an unwritten rule in the club and any that step out of line will be warned of the consequences. Germany pulls Brussels strings and any who step out do so at their peril.

 

[CCFCSteve]

Do we know when Novavax will enter production?

Not been approved yet but read somewhere early summer (assuming approved), so a while yet. Think Moderna is due to land in April from memory

 

[fernandopartridge]

While I agree on Robinson you do realise any EU state can give emergency approval for any vaccine? Like we did while under their rules?

That's a separate point from the bulk procurement.

 

[CCFCSteve]

This is classic eu federalism

Every member is straight armed into agreeing an en bloc decision and that decision will always then be there to benefit the strong nations in the cartel and the weaker ones are just told to stand at the back of the queue and be pummelled into submission

Still morons like Tony Robinson the other day were still slobbering over the EU and saying it’s not fair they are missing out as they care more about their citizens than rush through a vaccine that may have issues with it

It was then revealed he’d already had the vaccine

Maybe he's got a cunning plan

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

As I said there is an unwritten rule in the club and any that step out of line will be warned of the consequences. Germany pulls Brussels strings and any who step out do so at their peril.

Merkel leading the tanks into Estonia if they emergency approved?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

That's a separate point from the bulk procurement.

Not really any of the states can give emergency access ahead of EU wide licensing.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

As I said there is an unwritten rule in the club and any that step out of line will be warned of the consequences. Germany pulls Brussels strings and any who step out do so at their peril.

Exactly correct.

People can play semantics all they want, if we were still in the EU we would have been pushed in that direction as well. The fact we aren't is exactly why we are months ahead of other countries. Anyone trying to say brexit didn't play a part needs to give their head a wobble, but I expect they know the truth deep down.