Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (5 Viewers)

[CCFCSteve]

OK, so what about Obese people? At what point do they get refused treatment and categorised for clogging up the NHS because they chose to keep eating and choosing not to exercise etc.

There's an obsession with "clogging up beds" but how many are obese and how much could be prevented if they weren't?

Will that really get mentioned much?

Where does it end?

Id have no issue with an old lady who fell down the stairs being treated ahead of me if I’d got pissed up on a night out and caused myself some mischief.

I know the argument about obese people and understand some of the points you make but the fact is it takes literally a few minutes to get a jab to significant reduce the chance of ending up hospital/ICU. People not bothering/refusing can’t be given priority over those that have had the jab for themselves and/or the greater good

 

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[Brighton Sky Blue]

…let’s not forget the attempted ongoing acts of violence and intimidation and talk of hanging doctors and nurses too.

I've had some pretty obnoxious things directed my way mainly not on here for defending the vaccine.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Same here by all accounts Sick Boy (I heard 80-90%+). I think it should be made clear that vaccinated and/or other non Covid patients will have to take priority with ICU beds. It’s each to their own if people want to take the vaccine or not but everyone knows they are at higher risk of severe illness if they don’t, so these people* have got to accept if ICUs are full/filling up they have to wait in line. Sounds brutal but the fairest solution

If they aren’t worried about Covid most/all should be happy to accept this

*unless they cant for medical reasons

Impossible Pandora box to open

 

[skybluetony176]

I didn't say it was contagious. However if it's about clogging up the NHS and COVID then you are way more likely to be doing that if you are obese.

That's the thing, people go on about the strain on the NHS but if you mention obesity it's "but that isn't contagious". No, it isn't but if you are obese and catch something that is (not just COVID) then you are much more likely to be hospitalised / seriously ill from it compared to somebody who isn't obese.

Obesity is a much more complicated than taking scientific advice of Right Said Fred over actual scientists.

 

[Nick]

I don’t agree with differential treatment. That’s one hell of a slippery slope. Obesity and smoking are both side effects of untreated mental health issues IMO (I say that as a fat smoker), arguably anti vax sentiment is a side effect of a failed education and public health system.

I’ve not seen anyone say lock people up either. But if restrictions can be lifted for those who are vaccinated and if business want or need vaccinated staff that’s just the consequences of your own actions.

Let’s be honest as a fatty smoker if I could take a shot to put me at normal weight and never smoke again I’d take it today. But I can’t so it’s not comparable really.

Taking a shot doesn't mean you won't ever get COVID or Transmit COVID either though.

 

[shmmeee]

Taking a shot doesn't mean you won't ever get COVID or Transmit COVID either though.

Wearing a condom doesn’t mean you won’t get someone pregnant or get an STD but you still wrap up before shagging a rando in the Colly toilets.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I think that’s the point I’m trying to make. Drink driving is criminal but there’s a level of alcohol in the blood that’s ok
Speeding is similar 10% above the minimum is criminal but seems to be ok

So the equivalent of not having a vaccine wouldn’t be driving drunk I don’t think

Not all scenarios are the same. If you're working in a hospital or care home the threat you pose to people when unvaccinated is much higher than if you're going out to the football or a restaurant because it's got the highest concentration of vulnerable people with weaker immunity. The isolation rules themselves certainly need to end in schools and universities and in general ought to be relaxed because we know more about when people are most infectious

 

[Skybluefaz]

Wearing a condom doesn’t mean you won’t get someone pregnant or get an STD but you still wrap up before shagging a rando in the Colly toilets.

There's a metaphor for the ages.

 

[CCFCSteve]

Impossible Pandora box to open

Yeah, will never happen here. It’s what I’d say though then it’s individuals call what they do and what risk they’re willing to take. Other countries are taking far more drastic actions

 

[Nick]

Obesity is a much more complicated than taking scientific advice of Right Said Fred over actual scientists.

Of course in some cases it will be.

Just because people might be wary it doesn't mean they are listening to Right Said Fred though does it?

If you are fairly obese you are much more likely to be seriously ill from COVID (or be clogging up NHS beds)

 

[Sick Boy]

I've had some pretty obnoxious things directed my way mainly not on here for defending the vaccine.

Sorry to hear that, the only incident I’ve had was overhearing a security guard in a supermarket in Hove making a comment about me wearing a mask while over there in September. Not sure it’s a good idea for me to go back there again.

 

[clint van damme]

I didn't say it was contagious. However if it's about clogging up the NHS and COVID then you are way more likely to be doing that if you are obese.

That's the thing, people go on about the strain on the NHS but if you mention obesity it's "but that isn't contagious". No, it isn't but if you are obese and catch something that is (not just COVID) then you are much more likely to be hospitalised / seriously ill from it compared to somebody who isn't obese.

Look at the numbers in the thread Iposted, can you find any examples of the NHS being put under that much sustained pressure by obesity, or smoking or alcohol related issues?

It/they, are really shit comparisons. This is a once in a lifetime global pandemic.

 

[skybluetony176]

Taking a shot doesn't mean you won't ever get COVID or Transmit COVID either though.

Wearing a seatbelt doesn’t mean you won’t die in a car crash, wearing a crash helmet doesn’t mean that you won’t die in a motorcycle accident. Both significantly increase your chance of survival and reduce your chance of serious injury though. You could literally do this all day.

 

[Nick]

Wearing a condom doesn’t mean you won’t get someone pregnant or get an STD but you still wrap up before shagging a rando in the Colly toilets.

So why is there no massive push for people to lose weight to also protect them from COVID? Why aren't people being shamed for that? If anything in the first lockdown, it was almost encouraged the way there was the "one walk a day" type shite.

Nobody sane shags in those toilets, clearly it's the park up the road.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Sorry to hear that, the only incident I’ve had was overhearing a security guard in a supermarket in Hove making a comment about me wearing a mask while over there in September. Not sure it’s a good idea for me to go back there again.

It's like the climate change debate, when you want to use more technical arguments or data with anti vaxxers it's not allowed because the other party doesn't understand it or just says it's made up.

 

[Nick]

Look at the numbers in the thread Iposted, can you find any examples of the NHS being put under that much sustained pressure by obesity, or smoking or alcohol related issues?

It/they, are really shit comparisons. This is a once in a lifetime global pandemic.

How many hospitalisations per year are due to obesity?

 

[chiefdave]

OK, so what about Obese people? At what point do they get refused treatment and categorised for clogging up the NHS because they chose to keep eating and choosing not to exercise etc.

The diet industry in the UK alone is worth £2m. I'm pretty sure if you told people they just needed to turn up at their doctors every 6 months for a jab you'd pretty much eliminate obesity overnight.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

So why is there no massive push for people to lose weight to also protect them from COVID? Why aren't people being shamed for that? If anything in the first lockdown, it was almost encouraged the way there was the "one walk a day" type shite.

Nobody sane shags in those toilets, clearly it's the park up the road.

Well as someone who has only ever known being overweight I've been shamed and had the piss taken for decades. Do keep making it analogous to believing internet nonsense to not get jabbed

 

[Nick]

Wearing a seatbelt doesn’t mean you won’t die in a car crash, wearing a crash helmet doesn’t mean that you won’t die in a motorcycle accident. Both significantly increase your chance of survival and reduce your chance of serious injury though. You could literally do this all day.

Yeah, not being obese also reduces your chances significantly too.

 

[skybluetony176]

Of course in some cases it will be.

Just because people might be wary it doesn't mean they are listening to Right Said Fred though does it?

If you are fairly obese you are much more likely to be seriously ill from COVID (or be clogging up NHS beds)

Right said Fred are one of the conduits for the bollocks. Whether you’re specifically listening to them or not you’re clearly listening to the same bollocks and coming to the same ill informed conclusions.

 

[skybluetony176]

So why is there no massive push for people to lose weight to also protect them from COVID? Why aren't people being shamed for that? If anything in the first lockdown, it was almost encouraged the way there was the "one walk a day" type shite.

Nobody sane shags in those toilets, clearly it's the park up the road.

There’s always been a push for people to lose weight for the benefit of their health.

 

[shmmeee]

So why is there no massive push for people to lose weight to also protect them from COVID? Why aren't people being shamed for that? If anything in the first lockdown, it was almost encouraged the way there was the "one walk a day" type shite.

Nobody sane shags in those toilets, clearly it's the park up the road.

It’s been forgotten not just Boris did say after he caught it he was going to push that. Never happened though.

There’s been a massive push for people to lose weight for years though. But it’s a societal problem across the world we don’t have an easy solution for. What we have done is change planning law, advertising law, introduced a sugar tax, spend billions on public information, etc.

 

[Nick]

Well as someone who has only ever known being overweight I've been shamed and had the piss taken for decades. Do keep making it analogous to believing internet nonsense to not get jabbed

I meant in regards to COVID and hospitalisation and strain on the NHS rather than mates taking the piss.

Obesity is a massive factor with COVID.

I'm not saying it's a reason not to get jabbed, I am saying at what point should the rules and treatment be stopped if people refuse to try and lose weight.

 

[Nick]

There’s always been a push for people to lose weight for the benefit of their health.

Not so much COVID though? Especially in the younger population where Obesity seems to make more of a difference.

 

[clint van damme]

How many hospitalisations per year are due to obesity?

It's not relevant, not sure what you're not grasping?
This pandemic is putting the NHS under unheard of sustained pressure.
There is nothing to compare it to.
And just for the record I don't want to see anyone denied treatment or pushed to the back of the queue based on vacinne status, weight, being a smoker, being a piss head etc, etc.

 

[skybluetony176]

Yeah, not being obese also reduces your chances significantly too.

You’ve reached the point where you’re using your own argument to dismiss your own argument. Well done.

 

[Nick]

Right said Fred are one of the conduits for the bollocks. Whether you’re specifically listening to them or not you’re clearly listening to the same bollocks and coming to the same ill informed conclusions.

Again, just because people are wary for various reasons it doesn't mean they are listening to Right Said Fred.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

I meant in regards to COVID and hospitalisation and strain on the NHS rather than mates taking the piss.

Obesity is a massive factor with COVID.

I'm not saying it's a reason not to get jabbed, I am saying at what point should the rules and treatment be stopped if people refuse to try and lose weight.

It's not like I or others haven't tried...I get you assume everyone's overweight because they're greedy slobs, some sure but it's not that simple most of the time.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Again, just because people are wary for various reasons it doesn't mean they are listening to Right Said Fred.

I guarantee 99% of those reasons can be debunked in a few minutes

 

[Nick]

It's not relevant, not sure what you're not grasping?
This pandemic is putting the NHS under unheard of sustained pressure.
There is nothing to compare it to.
And just for the record I don't want to see anyone denied treatment or pushed to the back of the queue based on vacinne status, weight, being a smoker, being a piss head etc, etc.

So it's not relevant how many people are hospitalised due to obesity and putting strain on the NHS?

You haven't said about denying people treatment or locking them down, others have and that's just why I am pointing out it's a slippery slope to go down as where does it end.

 

[Nick]

It's not like I or others haven't tried...I get you assume everyone's overweight because they're greedy slobs, some sure but it's not that simple most of the time.

Not at all, I fully get it. I have been overweight also. I'm by no means pure muscle or a rake.

 

[skybluetony176]

Not so much COVID though? Especially in the younger population where Obesity seems to make more of a difference.

Actually Boris after he “caught” covid singled out his weight as a factor and increased funding to the NHS to help fight obesity. Amongst other things.

 

[Nick]

Actually Boris after he “caught” covid singled out his weight as a factor and increased funding to the NHS to help fight obesity. Amongst other things.

Oh it must be happening then.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Not at all, I fully get it. I have been overweight also. I'm by no means pure muscle or a rake.

The principle of the NHS is everyone's entitled to treatment but it's done by priority of need and where there is more people needing the service than it can accommodate, that's when you have to further prioritise. Until we reach such a point it's unhelpful to start discussing who should be denied treatment. It's the kind of decision no doctor ever wants to have to make

 

[skybluetony176]

Again, just because people are wary for various reasons it doesn't mean they are listening to Right Said Fred.

Which is exactly what I just pointed out. I clearly said they’re listening to the same bollocks right said Fred spout.