Kingokings204
Well-Known Member
True but One thing we do know is the budget will be cut. Make your assumptions from there.
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- Thread starter Nick
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True but One thing we do know is the budget will be cut. Make your assumptions from there.
Nick
Administrator
Did anybody ever say how bad it was?
He looked bad, but then walked off. Then he seemed to be going round the schools the next few days.
Nick
Administrator
Yes, because it's the league below and a massive ST boycott / natural loss of fans after relegation.
Kingokings204
Well-Known Member
Yes of course but hardly stable is it. They are two good players in Thomas and bigi. I personally would like them both to stay.
stupot07
Well-Known Member
I don't disagree - but turnover shouldn't drop significantly, the difference between PL payments, etc between L1+2 aren't as much as between L1 and Championship, if he Wingy's right and thre wage bill this season is £2.1m then I would guess another £200-300k cut leaving £1.8-1.9m. But we have people plucking figures out of the air of what people have been offered, etc. And someone saying that very few players were paid more than 66% league one average basic wage last season - it just doesn't stack up
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stupot07
Well-Known Member
Its not stable releasing half your squad per se - but this is what happens in league one and two. I don't think Bigi will stay but I think Thomas will.
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steve82
Well-Known Member
Seems sensible given the maths. I'm more thinking that we're not likely to pay above a grand a week, so is bigis agent gonna accept that? If he's wanting more is he worth it, when you can get something similar for less.
At a guess surely our average squad wage is gonna be around £600-£800 a week? Plus win bonuses. I think this could be a key addition.
Do we think that's about right?
Nick
Administrator
This was the team of the year for League 2:
Goalkeeper: David Forde (Portsmouth)
Right-back: Kelvin Mellor (Blackpool)
Centre-back: Christian Burgess (Portsmouth)
Centre-back: Sonny Bradley (Plymouth Argyle)
Left-back: Enda Stevens (Portsmouth)
Midfield: Brad Potts (Blackpool)
Midfield: James Coppinger (Doncaster Rovers)
Midfield: Graham Carey (Plymouth Argyle)
Forward: John Marquis (Doncaster Rovers)
Forward: Matthew Godden (Stevenage)
Forward: Ollie Watkins (Exeter City)
Other than Marquis and Coppinger I can't say I'd heard of them.
Goalkeeper: David Forde (Portsmouth)
Right-back: Kelvin Mellor (Blackpool)
Centre-back: Christian Burgess (Portsmouth)
Centre-back: Sonny Bradley (Plymouth Argyle)
Left-back: Enda Stevens (Portsmouth)
Midfield: Brad Potts (Blackpool)
Midfield: James Coppinger (Doncaster Rovers)
Midfield: Graham Carey (Plymouth Argyle)
Forward: John Marquis (Doncaster Rovers)
Forward: Matthew Godden (Stevenage)
Forward: Ollie Watkins (Exeter City)
Other than Marquis and Coppinger I can't say I'd heard of them.
oldskyblue58
CCFC Finance Director
Really not surprised by the clear out. most of the players have proven themselves not up to the task. Even the brief improvement under Robins flattered to deceive
As for salaries. League 2 average 2016 were around £40k before bonuses according to a quick google search I did. Managers around an average of 50k. That would be an average squad cost of 24 players under £1m - you would need a turnover of 1.75m to meet the SCMP an average crowd around 7600 would cover the player basic wages
As for salaries. League 2 average 2016 were around £40k before bonuses according to a quick google search I did. Managers around an average of 50k. That would be an average squad cost of 24 players under £1m - you would need a turnover of 1.75m to meet the SCMP an average crowd around 7600 would cover the player basic wages
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Earlsdon-Loyal-Blue
Well-Known Member
Would love to see G Thomas stay but it's nailed on he will go as soon as a shite championship or decent League 1 team offer him a spot on the bench for 2/3k a week. Shame as think his game would of come on along under Robins.
Sbarcher
Well-Known Member
For a team looking for success, wins bonuses are a must. A mate of mine was a youth player at Celtic and broke into the first team due to suspensions and injuries. The win bonus was over 10x his weekly wage and having won the first game he played in, he held his place in the first team not wanting to lose the bunce (OK , it's Celtic and winning is a habit!). He was not alone in making more on the win bonus than normal wages many of the squad were too, and if you scored there was a hefty additional reward.
If it's 0-0 at 85 mins, maybe the thought of the bonus may be more important than camping in our 18yd area.
If it's 0-0 at 85 mins, maybe the thought of the bonus may be more important than camping in our 18yd area.
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
The selling point would be if he stayed for next season, ended up coming up with that mythical 20 goals a season, his negotiating hand would be a lot stronger to get the move he wanted.
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
Maybe but there is a fair spread.
A rookie goalie would probably only get 20-25% of a proven 20 goal a season strikers wages.
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
I don't think either of them will stay.
stupot07
Well-Known Member
Far too many variables to state this as fact.
- Haynes played in most if not all thr cup games
- knowl also did one for lamieres which was even better stats iirc, perhaps its because Haynes plays when lamieres plays
- manager - Haynes has played more under Robin's who has a good record and leas under mowbray, Venus and slade.
- our record is worse away from home, perhaps Haynes has played more games at home than away? (I don't know, just saying it could be a variable)
- who were thr opposition? Has Haynes played mostly against inferior opposition? (Dunno just throwing out another variable)
-etc
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steve82
Well-Known Member
Interesting but what's it purely on the league wins as how many of them wins with Haynes were checkatrade trophy wins.
KG7
Well-Known Member
Pedantic but, it is a fact. Too many variables to state it as cause and effect ;-)
HuckerbyDublinWhelan
Well-Known Member
I don't get the worry over George Thomas, for 3/4 of the season he was woeful. Luckily he peaked at around the time Wembley was coming up, and luckily rode that wave.
He shown much improvement under Robins and to an extent towards the end of The Slade era. I doubt he'll be going anywhere. Against Peterborough he could have easily had 2/3 more. His finishing isn't quite there and teams won't sign 9 goal strikers who just work hard.
FWIW I think League 2 will be his level, up until recently he only looked good against them teams
He shown much improvement under Robins and to an extent towards the end of The Slade era. I doubt he'll be going anywhere. Against Peterborough he could have easily had 2/3 more. His finishing isn't quite there and teams won't sign 9 goal strikers who just work hard.
FWIW I think League 2 will be his level, up until recently he only looked good against them teams
steve82
Well-Known Member
W4 D4 L11 with Haynes
Not in the squad 23 times unused sub 4 times in the league only.
Only mainly featured under Slade who brought him back in against Bolton, and Robins used him too. Didn't feature under MV and twice under TM.
Otis
Well-Known Member
Glad to see the back of Kyel Reid if this is true. Far, far too inconsistent and a bad signing. Gadzhev too. Another bad signing. Think the clue to him being picked of late was in Robins revealing that 12 players are injured.
Lameiras staying does leave me scratching my head.
Be interesting to see if Bigi and Thomas accept and stay.
Sad to see Stokes go, but not so much Haynes.
stevefloyd
Well-Known Member
We have limited funds he was injured for the major part of this season and again got injured we need someone who can play every game hopefully whip quality balls in the box and be quick Stokes is at present none of those, Haynes may well have been offered a new deal and turned it down hence the reason he is going too.
We can probably start the season with as many players as is needed then see where we are come the January window and strenghten in numbers then for the run in and hope some of the academy guys have stepped up by then
Like a lot have said, disappointed that he has let Stokes go, always rated him and fully fit, is a championship level player to me.Unless he has real injury concerns, or has been offered better terms elsewhere it would seem a bad call.
I presume he has kept Cooke and released Burge purely because Cooke was still in contract and Burge wasn't. But as he clearly preferred Burge,as did all our other managers,this seems a budget decision rather than a player decision.A lot of fans have called for a more experienced keeper, but I'm not sure an ageing journeyman keeper willing to play in effectively division 4 ,will necessarily be that much of an improvement,time will tell.
A lot of fans quite rightly questioned Haynes defensive skills, but of late I felt that he had improved a little,and going forward he always had a goal in him, Considering we always seem to struggle for goals I felt he would have been worth persevering with.
Whilst most fans expected Gadzhev to go, it begs the question why did Robins opt to play him in the last couple of games,surely it would have been more beneficial to play players he wants here next season.
Never been a fan of Laimeras, although I accept his win/games ratio is quite high. But can never remember a game where he really stood out,and even in this division you see him being easily bullied. Over a course of a full season would still expect him to score less goals than even Haynes.
The rest not that bothered that we have released them. I expect there will be a few more leaving in an expected fire sale, but I'm not sure we will obtain the fees some expect though. A lot of fans have remarked that this is the worst squad in our history, therefore it surely follows we shouldn't expect big fees for 4th tier footballers.
I presume he has kept Cooke and released Burge purely because Cooke was still in contract and Burge wasn't. But as he clearly preferred Burge,as did all our other managers,this seems a budget decision rather than a player decision.A lot of fans have called for a more experienced keeper, but I'm not sure an ageing journeyman keeper willing to play in effectively division 4 ,will necessarily be that much of an improvement,time will tell.
A lot of fans quite rightly questioned Haynes defensive skills, but of late I felt that he had improved a little,and going forward he always had a goal in him, Considering we always seem to struggle for goals I felt he would have been worth persevering with.
Whilst most fans expected Gadzhev to go, it begs the question why did Robins opt to play him in the last couple of games,surely it would have been more beneficial to play players he wants here next season.
Never been a fan of Laimeras, although I accept his win/games ratio is quite high. But can never remember a game where he really stood out,and even in this division you see him being easily bullied. Over a course of a full season would still expect him to score less goals than even Haynes.
The rest not that bothered that we have released them. I expect there will be a few more leaving in an expected fire sale, but I'm not sure we will obtain the fees some expect though. A lot of fans have remarked that this is the worst squad in our history, therefore it surely follows we shouldn't expect big fees for 4th tier footballers.
Esoterica
Well-Known Member
If the rumours of turning down cash for Lameiras in January are true then at 22 years old this has got to be just to make him eligible for compensation, surely? Even 50k comp would pay an above average L2 footballer plus whatever we'd save on his own salary (which is pretty low I'd guess and is therefore not a huge risk should he chooses to sign it)
Manchester_sky_blue
Well-Known Member
Maybe so. I guess we can ill afford to carry injury prone players.
I am pleased that G Thomas is staying though, or at least has the option to stay. He has come on leaps and bounds and could be a real handful in League 2.
D
Deleted member 5849
Guest
Don't get me wrong, I'd keep him.
Just trying to see the logic, and can only assume that's it.
HuckerbyDublinWhelan
Well-Known Member
This is why I can't understand not offering Haynes a deal. If we offered him a nominal contract, someone will come in anyway and take him - we'd get compo for him
stevefloyd
Well-Known Member
Still atm its only click bait and we dont as yet have an official list
Nick
Administrator
Doesn't he have to have been in our academy for compensation?
LilleSkyBlue
Well-Known Member
Far too much turnover every summer - most of the teams at our level do it and it rarely seems to work.
Last season it was a disaster for us. You can call it a clearout of dead wood if you like but then every summer is yet another throw of the dice, players coming in second or third or fourth-choice end of August, not having a full pre-season etc. Conditions all in place for bringing in what will become more dead wood.
Of those reckoned to be leaving we ought to keep Haynes, Stokes, K. Thomas, Rose, Turnbull and Burge.
We ought to be doing all we can to keep Stevenson, Willis and Harries, too. Continuity.
This is the real world though and we'll be kicking off next season with a weaker squad (perhaps unsurprising in L2) of patched together unknowns.
Last season it was a disaster for us. You can call it a clearout of dead wood if you like but then every summer is yet another throw of the dice, players coming in second or third or fourth-choice end of August, not having a full pre-season etc. Conditions all in place for bringing in what will become more dead wood.
Of those reckoned to be leaving we ought to keep Haynes, Stokes, K. Thomas, Rose, Turnbull and Burge.
We ought to be doing all we can to keep Stevenson, Willis and Harries, too. Continuity.
This is the real world though and we'll be kicking off next season with a weaker squad (perhaps unsurprising in L2) of patched together unknowns.
ccfcway
Well-Known Member
pal of mine who is a Burnley fan said they are in for him and will be offering him a contract. He asked me who he was, as he heard it on their local radio station
Esoterica
Well-Known Member
There's 2 compensation types: Where a professional player, under the age of 24, has been offered a new contract by his club (subject to certain requirements that the offer must meet set out in Rule 64.3 of the Football League Rules) and he rejects that offer in order to take up the opportunity to sign for another club, compensation will be payable. This is not to be confused with training compensation under the EPPP regime (that applies to Academy players), an entirely different proposition.
James Collins, released without playing for Villa as a kid is similar to Lameiras and Spurs:
- James Collins joined League Two club Shrewsbury Town as 21 year old striker in January 2011, having previously been an Aston Villa player (who made no first team appearances for Villa).
- Quickly establishing himself as a first-team regular, James appeared 66 times in the League for Shrewsbury between 2011 and 2012, scoring 22 League goals. In the 2011/2012 season, Shrewsbury won promotion and James was their top scorer.
- In the summer of 2012, only 18 months after signing for Shrewsbury, an out-of-contract James signed for Swindon Town, who themselves had just been promoted to League One.
- The PFCC decided that Swindon Town should pay Shrewsbury an initial compensation fee of £140,000.
- Additionally, further payments of £20,000 after 15, 30, 45 and 60 appearances (totalling up to £80,000) would be due.
- Swindon would also pay Shrewsbury 20% of any profit it makes from selling the player to another club at any point in the future.
Compensation for players under 24