USSR invades Ukraine. (38 Viewers)

[Sky Blue Pete]

out of interest Pete as you find it amusing would you agree the Japanese culture and behaviour in the war was the very definition of sub human

Your comment was amusing at dreamer. Any more so than any other party ? Probably not no. That’s not to say it wasn’t sub human. It was but so is killing another person because they were born in a different country

 

---

[Grendel]

Describing Japanese culture as “sub human” sounds……pretty racist to me?

Oh please - Peters inference was the us treated them as such and given their barbarism especially in the previous battles in China where they condemned hundreds of thousands of women to enslavement and systematic rape, chemical and some form of germ warfare and then acts of degradation and destruction on all their enemies it’s not my understanding of humanity. yet of course on good old SBT it’s the western cultures behaviour in the war that is more scrutinised as some kind of racially motivated attack and none of this gets a mention

 

[Grendel]

Your comment was amusing at dreamer. Any more so than any other party ? Probably not no. That’s not to say it wasn’t sub human. It was but so is killing another person because they were born in a different country

fair enough

WHAT WAS THE BATTLE FOR AUSTRALIA 1942-43? – Pacific War

www.pacificwar.org.au

 

[SBT]

Oh please - Peters inference was the us treated them as such and given their barbarism especially in the previous battles in China where they condemned hundreds of thousands of women to enslavement and systematic rape, chemical and some form of germ warfare and then acts of degradation and destruction on all their enemies it’s not my understanding of humanity. yet of course on good old SBT it’s the western cultures behaviour in the war that is more scrutinised as some kind of racially motivated attack and none of this gets a mention

Well I don’t think Pete’s inference was something he was looking for people on here to agree with in the year 2022, but ok.

The suggestion that Japanese war crimes = Japanese culture is pretty weird too. But more than anything find it bizarre that in a thread discussing war crimes, the holocaust and the like, you’ve got people casually dismissing entire cultures as sub-human without any sense of irony.

 

[Grendel]

Well I don’t think Pete’s inference was something he was looking for people on here to agree with in the year 2022, but ok.

The suggestion that Japanese war crimes = Japanese culture is pretty weird too. But more than anything find it bizarre that in a thread discussing war crimes, the holocaust and the like, you’ve got people casually dismissing entire cultures as sub-human without any sense of irony.

If we want some irony I thought I’d look at responses to the article by Mr Paris

The article was pretty lame. However it seems the woke mob have moved on him. They’ve done their research - Tory wanker, Tory brexit racist tosser, Tory Nazi

A minuscule of research would show all that to be ironic indeed

 

[Otis]

fair enough

WHAT WAS THE BATTLE FOR AUSTRALIA 1942-43? – Pacific War

www.pacificwar.org.au

Truly awful isn't it. I knew they committed some atrocities. I didn't realise it was THAT bad.

 

[tisza]

Fear for a real escalation now they've refused to surrender the city.
Cynic in me wonders whether Ukranian leadership is "hoping" an escalation in civilian atrocities in Mariupol may push West/Allies into some sort of action.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

Fear for a real escalation now they've refused to surrender the city.
Cynic in me wonders whether Ukranian leadership is "hoping" an escalation in civilian atrocities in Mariupol may push West/Allies into some sort of action.

What doesn’t an escalation look like? It’s truly horrific already isn’t it? You would think there’d be a way for the world community to agree a way of getting the tens of thousands of civilians out of the city

 

[stupot07]

What doesn’t an escalation look like? It’s truly horrific already isn’t it? You would think there’d be a way for the world community to agree a way of getting the tens of thousands of civilians out of the city

The West have been stupid but ruling out any military intervention. I'm not saying they should intervene but taking the notion of a no fly zone off and removed any threat and a potential bargaining chip.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

 

[Philosoraptor]

The West have been stupid but ruling out any military intervention. I'm not saying they should intervene but taking the notion of a no fly zone off and removed any threat and a potential bargaining chip.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

Sounds like the precursor to WWIII putting a no-fly zone up.

 

[stupot07]

Sounds like the precursor to WWIII putting a no-fly zone up.

Yes, it does. I'm not saying do it, but just not take it off the table, even if you have no intention to do it.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

 

[Philosoraptor]

Could these be some of the neo-Nazi's that Russia is talking about?

It is part of Ukraine's Ministry of Internal Affairs.

Azov Brigade - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Philosoraptor]

The main talking point would be below.

In March 2022, Deutsche Welle reported that the battalion was the primary unit defending Mariupol in the siege of Mariupol.

Which is also coincidentally the headlines.

Home - BBC News

Visit BBC News for up-to-the-minute news, breaking news, video, audio and feature stories. BBC News provides trusted World and UK news as well as local and regional perspectives. Also entertainment, business, science, technology and health news.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[CCFCSteve]

Yes, it does. I'm not saying do it, but just not take it off the table, even if you have no intention to do it.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

Yeah, I’ve always felt the West should’ve left further involvement ambiguous mentioning civilian targeting, war crimes, use of nuclear weapons, safety of nuclear reactors etc all of which could trigger a response from us

I’d never have supported military action but as you say, you don’t take stuff off the table….unless you feel they might specifically target one of the above to trigger a reaction from the West ?!

Who knows, it’s hard to second guess someone totally lacking in any empathy or appreciation of human life

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

The West have been stupid but ruling out any military intervention. I'm not saying they should intervene but taking the notion of a no fly zone off and removed any threat and a potential bargaining chip.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

Equally it could have meant Russia decided to act differently. Hindsight is only good after an event isn’t it? I can’t believe the international community can’t step in for civilians

 

[SBT]

If we want some irony I thought I’d look at responses to the article by Mr Paris

The article was pretty lame. However it seems the woke mob have moved on him. They’ve done their research - Tory wanker, Tory brexit racist tosser, Tory Nazi

A minuscule of research would show all that to be ironic indeed

I mean, literally no-one asked, but I’m sure “Mr Paris” is glad you’re jumping to his defence on here.

What’s more worrying is your refusal to acknowledge how disgraceful it is to call an entire culture “sub human” based on the actions of its military. I’m sure you’d be rightfully appalled if someone tried to say the same about Israel and Jewish culture - it’s attempts like that to dehumanise an entire race of people which typically precede atrocities like the Holocaust, and it’s shocking that you would casually use that language today.

Of course I’m sure you’re not actually a raving ethno-fascist lunatic - I’m happy to delete this post if you just admit your language was careless and apologise, which I assume won’t be a problem for you, but it’s important to call that language out even if it was used accidentally.

 

[Grendel]

I mean, literally no-one asked, but I’m sure “Mr Paris” is glad you’re jumping to his defence on here.

What’s more worrying is your refusal to acknowledge how disgraceful it is to call an entire culture “sub human” based on the actions of its military. I’m sure you’d be rightfully appalled if someone tried to say the same about Israel and Jewish culture - it’s attempts like that to dehumanise an entire race of people which typically precede atrocities like the Holocaust, and it’s shocking that you would casually use that language today.

Of course I’m sure you’re not actually a raving ethno-fascist lunatic - I’m happy to delete this post if you just admit your language was careless and apologise, which I assume won’t be a problem for you, but it’s important to call that language out even if it was used accidentally.

grow up

 

[SBT]

grow up

Are there any other cultures you find sub human then, or is it just the Japanese?

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

I mean, literally no-one asked, but I’m sure “Mr Paris” is glad you’re jumping to his defence on here.

What’s more worrying is your refusal to acknowledge how disgraceful it is to call an entire culture “sub human” based on the actions of its military. I’m sure you’d be rightfully appalled if someone tried to say the same about Israel and Jewish culture - it’s attempts like that to dehumanise an entire race of people which typically precede atrocities like the Holocaust, and it’s shocking that you would casually use that language today.

Of course I’m sure you’re not actually a raving ethno-fascist lunatic - I’m happy to delete this post if you just admit your language was careless and apologise, which I assume won’t be a problem for you, but it’s important to call that language out even if it was used accidentally.

I think you nail it. The defence for genocide is always made in the minds of the transgressor by saying they are something less than us. That was all I was suggesting about the second atomic bomb and holocaust. The planning and sheer number of people killed makes it a horror on a different level but the base is thinking of another group as something less than human. I suppose pro lifers would say the same way most of society treats the unborn

 

[Grendel]

Are there any other cultures you find sub human then, or is it just the Japanese?

i don’t I think the Japanese culture today is extremely admirable

 

[Grendel]

I think you nail it. The defence for genocide is always made in the minds of the transgressor by saying they are something less than us. That was all I was suggesting about the second atomic bomb and holocaust. The planning and sheer number of people killed makes it a horror on a different level but the base is thinking of another group as something less than human. I suppose pro lifers would say the same way most of society treats the unborn

it was nothing to do with that - the bombs were seen as a solution to save lives - it was nothing to do with what you say at all.

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

do you honestly believe this tripe? Why do you even type it only Pete seems to read it

So are you saying history isn't written and consequences decided by the victors?

Also, how do you know it's tripe if only Pete reads it?

 

[tisza]

What doesn’t an escalation look like? It’s truly horrific already isn’t it? You would think there’d be a way for the world community to agree a way of getting the tens of thousands of civilians out of the city

Escalation can take many forms particularly in the type of weapons used and general rules of engagement.

 

[SBT]

i don’t I think the Japanese culture today is extremely admirable

Very progressive of you! Any other cultures today you find to be sub human? Or is it only people from 75 years ago who you didn’t consider to be fully human?

 

[Grendel]

So are you saying history isn't written and consequences decided by the victors?

Also, how do you know it's tripe if only Pete reads it?

Oh I know because you literally bring every discussion into some anti capitalist and anti west claptrap

The US is the glue that holds this planet together and capitalism and western democracy is utopia yo any alternative - your constant lengthy diatribes are boring and convince no one so why waste your energy. Why not spend your time earning as much money as you can (as unlike some of the sheep on here you clearly are far from stupid) then you can real better rewards and that bitterness will soon melt away

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Oh please - Peters inference was the us treated them as such and given their barbarism especially in the previous battles in China where they condemned hundreds of thousands of women to enslavement and systematic rape, chemical and some form of germ warfare and then acts of degradation and destruction on all their enemies it’s not my understanding of humanity. yet of course on good old SBT it’s the western cultures behaviour in the war that is more scrutinised as some kind of racially motivated attack and none of this gets a mention

I've not said the Japanese actions weren't utterly despicable. They were, and not just in that conflict.

Your argument was that the atomic bombs were justified because they brought about a quicker end to the war (something which is likely true but subjective as to how long it would have gone on for and the number of people that would've died as a result).

I'm saying that the first bomb would have been enough to bring about that early end to the war, and all that was needed was to threaten another for them to cave. So the second bomb actually did nothing in expediating the end of the war and thus civilians were killed needlessly.

Just for context, how many nuclear bombs to bring about an early end of the war would you have thought was justified? If they'd dropped three, four, five would that have been fine? If these bombs supposedly saved millions of lives by bringing the war to an early close surely as long as less than millions are killed then it's fine? Why was one not enough and two just the right amount? If Russia used horrific weapons that caused the Ukrainian resistance to give up, thus ending the war and saving loads of people from dying in a drawn out conflict, would that be acceptable?

 

[Grendel]

Very progressive of you! Any other cultures today you find to be sub human? Or is it only people from 75 years ago who you didn’t consider to be fully human?

Its hardly progressive it’s a statement of fact. They considered themselves to be below another human (their great leader) and behaved accordingly

I did find your “I’ll delete my post if you apologise” funny though. I mean that really made me worried

 

[Grendel]

I've not said the Japanese actions weren't utterly despicable. They were, and not just in that conflict.

Your argument was that the atomic bombs were justified because they brought about a quicker end to the war (something which is likely true but subjective as to how long it would have gone on for and the number of people that would've died as a result).

I'm saying that the first bomb would have been enough to bring about that early end to the war, and all that was needed was to threaten another for them to cave. So the second bomb actually did nothing in expediating the end of the war and thus civilians were killed needlessly.

Just for context, how many nuclear bombs to bring about an early end of the war would you have thought was justified? If they'd dropped three, four, five would that have been fine? If these bombs supposedly saved millions of lives by bringing the war to an early close surely as long as less than millions are killed then it's fine? Why was one not enough and two just the right amount? If Russia used horrific weapons that caused the Ukrainian resistance to give up, thus ending the war and saving loads of people from dying in a drawn out conflict, would that be acceptable?

hes off again

 

[Sky_Blue_Dreamer]

Oh I know because you literally bring every discussion into some anti capitalist and anti west claptrap

The US is the glue that holds this planet together and capitalism and western democracy is utopia yo any alternative - your constant lengthy diatribes are boring and convince no one so why waste your energy. Why not spend your time earning as much money as you can (as unlike some of the sheep on here you clearly are far from stupid) then you can real better rewards and that bitterness will soon melt away

I've tried the earning loads of money - found it totally unfulfilling.

As my username suggests, I think we can move beyond this way of living and make life more bearable for more people and so making it a better place to live and getting rid of a lot of the envy and hatred and thus reducing the need for war, crime and corruption. Basically cappeditalism - one were the word 'enough' exists.

 

[SBT]

Its hardly progressive it’s a statement of fact. They considered themselves to be below another human (their great leader) and behaved accordingly

I did find your “I’ll delete my post if you apologise” funny though. I mean that really made me worried

What you’re describing is a hierarchy - being part of one doesn’t make someone sub human.

But seeing as you disagree, how would you yourself treat these sub human Japanese people? Would you be ok using them as slaves? Hunting them for sport? Medical experiments? Just want to tease out the Grendel ethnic ideology here.

(A reminder that we never had to have this discussion but you decided to double down!)

 

[Ccfcisparks]

Very progressive of you! Any other cultures today you find to be sub human? Or is it only people from 75 years ago who you didn’t consider to be fully human?

To be honest Japanese culture outside of the military is not healthy. There are some real desperate people in that country.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

it was nothing to do with that - the bombs were seen as a solution to save lives - it was nothing to do with what you say at all.

In your opinion. The documentary I watched just made that point so it’s clearly a well known and articulated opinion. There was dissent from the Vice President to using the weapon at the time

 

[tisza]

In your opinion. The documentary I watched just made that point so it’s clearly a well known and articulated opinion. There was dissent from the Vice President to using the weapon at the time

Looking back and analysing decision-making is always different from the decision-making at the time.
Issues at the time were Japanese were still fighting hard and an invasion of mainland Japan would have been extremely difficult in terms of loss of life. Relationship with Russia had already broken down so a swift conclusion was also desirable.
American public anger at Japanese (rather Germans or Italians) primarily came from the sneak attack at Pearl Harbour and drawing USA into a world war. Germans or Italians never attacked the USA directly. Roosevelt had already said in 1940 USA wasn't going to fight in Europe. Was a lot of domestic resentment about joining in WW1. So Japan was blamed a lot for all the US deaths in WW2.

 

[skybluetony176]

The racism was rife on both sides. The US had cartoons portraying the Japanese as rats with buck teeth, slitty eyes, straw hair and thick glasses that they used to show before movies in cinemas and put the image on posters. The caricature of the Japanese (and other Asians for that matter) still prevalent in Hollywood well into the 60’s and 70’s where you would see a white actor playing someone from the Far East with a yellow fake tan, straw hair, buck teeth etc etc.

The Japanese thought that everyone was below them and the emperor was a Devine being.

Big difference between them is that the Japanese (much like the Germans) seem to have for the most part learned the lessons of WW2. Unlike the victors. The price of victory I guess.

 

[Sky Blue Pete]

The racism was rife on both sides. The US had cartoons portraying the Japanese as rats with buck teeth, slitty eyes, straw hair and thick glasses that they used to show before movies in cinemas and put the image on posters. The caricature of the Japanese (and other Asians for that matter) still prevalent in Hollywood well into the 60’s and 70’s where you would see a white actor playing someone from the Far East with a yellow fake tan, straw hair, buck teeth etc etc.

The Japanese thought that everyone was below them and the emperor was a Devine being.

Big difference between them is that the Japanese (much like the Germans) seem to have for the most part learned the lessons of WW2. Unlike the victors. The price of victory I guess.

Yeah