Sick Boy
Super Moderator
In that case, why aren’t those funding Ukraine sending in troops? If there’s no risk of WW3, what’s the issue?
USSR invades Ukraine. (12 Viewers)
- Thread starter Alan Dugdales Moustache
- Start date
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Indeed
Surely you can see the difference between sending arms/aid and sending in soldiers to be killed?
Naive to think that no,there'll always be a member of Eton dreaming of charging down the step?
Better to do it without having any Americans killed though, which is exactly what they were doing until the Republicans shat their pants.
The US were crippling one of their main adversary's army without losing a man, without having to declare war, just by sending over a load of outdated (to them) kit.
Why would they risk all that by putting boots on the ground?
Of course it was. We're over 2 years into a 3 day war in which time they've lost:
Over 300,000 men
Goodness knows how many thousands of tanks
Half of their black sea fleet, including the flagship of that fleet, to a country with no navy
Lost more men taking one small town in 4 months than they did in 10 years of the Soviet afghan war
That is not sustainable.
I said it *was* being crippled.
And Russia has the upper hand purely because US support has dried up. There is a direct correlation.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
I imagine there’s reluctance after seeing what happened with the counter-offensive. Obviously they’re not going to openly say it.
A stalemate which was unsustainable for the attacking side taking hugely disproportionate losses.
With funding in place the Russian army was being crippled. Even if it was a stalemate in ground it was not a stalemate in losses, that's what you don't seem to understand.
Without funding they can advance.
This is on Trump and his loyal arse sniffers.
There's been a lot more of this sort of rhetoric in the last week or so. Europe seems to be finally waking up to what's happening.
Shame we've missed the best chance to drive Russia out of Ukraine (largely thanks to the Republicans, not the EU of course)
amp.theguardian.com
Shame we've missed the best chance to drive Russia out of Ukraine (largely thanks to the Republicans, not the EU of course)
EU leaders urged to put economies ‘on war footing’ at Ukraine negotiations | Ukraine | The Guardian
Prime ministers to examine plans to confiscate billions of euros in interest from frozen Russian assets and send the money to Kyiv
No
You can surely see things could escalate without it turning to WW3? Putin is constantly being quoted saying he’ll escalate things and take revenge on any country that puts boots on the ground, not to mention the political ramifications back home of any leader who sends their soldiers to die.
Flying Fokker
Well-Known Member
duffer
Well-Known Member
It obviously wasn't a stalemate until the Russians pulled back and then had time to dig in. If the West had been willing to provide F-16s and long range ordnance from the start, that might not have happened.
As for the situation now, Ukraine isn't asking for NATO troops, just for enough weapons and ammunition to continue the fight themselves.
Ukraine has already "won" to some degree, given the fact that there's not a puppet Government in Kyiv right now. What they're asking for now is sufficient support to defend what they hold and inflict as much damage as possible on their invaders.
You could reasonably argue that the quickest way to end this could be to give Ukraine as much material support as it asks for. Long range ordnance, aircraft, and ammunition, inevitably makes it considerably more painful for Russia to press on or even keep what they've got.
Putin might want to keep going, but sooner or later the poor bastards on the front line and their families won't. If Ukraine has to negotiate a peace, they need to be able to do so from a position of relative strength.
Flying Fokker
Well-Known Member
So, the last 5 mins make for chilling listening.
Flying Fokker
Well-Known Member
Flying Fokker
Well-Known Member
Russia preparing 100,000 soldiers for major offensive as Kremlin says it is ‘at war’
Russia is amassing a new force of 100,000 troops for a potential summer offensive, the commander of Ukraine’s ground forces warned on Friday.
Islamic State claims Moscow concert hall attack
Islamic State claimed responsibility on Friday for a deadly attack that saw gunmen in combat gear burst into a concert hall in Moscow, spraying bullets into the crowd and throwing explosives.
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Alan Dugdales Moustache
Well-Known Member
It's not really worth me spending the weekend putting in some new fence posts then..
Flying Fokker
Well-Known Member
If you’re on your own, maybe you’re right. Otherwise, keep to plan.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
In the UN? It was on a ceasefire in Gaza and Russia and China either abstained or voted against it, which I think ultimately leads to the same result in UN votes IIRC.
Yeah it was more what was the actual vote about really? Did it have conditional clauses of any type?
Grendel
Well-Known Member
Yes - hostage releases
Ukraine already declaring it a false flag. Very early, so either they know it was or they just preempting Russia calling it.
