Wasps downward spiral... (21 Viewers)

[Grendel]

That's the point, what happens if the only person interested in taking them on when Richardson wants to get out is a Wasps fan who wants them back in London. How do you untangle the mess.

Why would anyone want them back in London - the training centre is here and they have a sub lease on a low rent I would guess

 

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[Brighton Sky Blue]

Why would anyone want them back in London - the training centre is here and they have a sub lease on a low rent I would guess

I mean they could piss off somewhere more local. Perhaps try to nick Solihull’s ground and get that giant to play hooker

 

[Grendel]

I mean they could piss off somewhere more local. Perhaps try to nick Solihull’s ground and get that giant to play hooker

They have a sub lease why does no one understand that?

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

They have a sub lease why does no one understand that?

I was being facetious

 

[Grendel]

I was being facetious

Still, people seem very confused by this. It means the rugby club is going nowhere

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Still, people seem very confused by this. It means the rugby club is going nowhere

Well at least not by force but ultimately Richardson can take them wherever he likes or dispose of them

 

[chiefdave]

As for Wasps being despised in the Rugby community like MK Dons. ….. I’d love to see where anyone sees that.

If you, or anyone else, cares to dig far enough back you'll find a post from me in response to our old friend Italia where I posted a bunch of quotes for other Premiership rugby clubs forums. Italia used to make the same claim, that nobody but a few of our fans objected to the move.

 

[Gynnsthetonic]

Interesting ….. my understanding is very different…. Perhaps we agree to disagree.

When I've been up stood with supporters, been on corporate days in the lounge and listened to speeches from vice presidents and directors I'd say they are not well liked

 

[Dubai-Dodger]

If you, or anyone else, cares to dig far enough back you'll find a post from me in response to our old friend Italia where I posted a bunch of quotes for other Premiership rugby clubs forums. Italia used to make the same claim, that nobody but a few of our fans objected to the move.

And how long ago was that ? …. Perhaps a few vocal posters back then as there were many Wasps supporters opposed to the move …… what’s the feeling now ? ….. how many rugby supporters are still banging the same old drum…… there have been a few posts recently because of the bond and accounts etc ….. apart from that almost nothing … it’s been accepted and rugby supporters have moved on.

 

[Dubai-Dodger]

When I've been up stood with supporters, been on corporate days in the lounge and listened to speeches from vice presidents and directors I'd say they are not well liked

fair enough …. As I said we agree to disagree

 

[Grendel]

Well at least not by force but ultimately Richardson can take them wherever he likes or dispose of them

But he’s hardly going to move them and selling the club they would stay

 

[chiefdave]

so …… a 28 mile move to Adam’s Park outside of London is allowed but an 82 mile move is not allowed. ….. what would you suggest is the limit of an acceptable move for a rugby team ?

The move to Adams Park was similar to our moves to Northampton and Birmingham, far from ideal but, at least according to those in charge, done out of necessity with a promise to return at the earliest opportunity. That's very different to moving permanently halfway across the country.

 

[Grendel]

The move to Adams Park was similar to our moves to Northampton and Birmingham, far from ideal but, at least according to those in charge, done out of necessity with a promise to return at the earliest opportunity. That's very different to moving permanently halfway across the country.

But it’s not really as attendance is about the same abs moving back to London would cost £100m plus - the club isn’t going anywhere

 

[chiefdave]

But it’s not really as attendance is about the same abs moving back to London would cost £100m plus - the club isn’t going anywhere

not really sure what point you're trying to make here. personally I don't see how the attendance being the same here as at Adam's Park makes moving a club across the country acceptable. If the crowds had been bigger at Northampton or Birmingham should we have accepted being there permanently?

 

[Grendel]

not really sure what point you're trying to make here. personally I don't see how the attendance being the same here as at Adam's Park makes moving a club across the country acceptable. If the crowds had been bigger at Northampton or Birmingham should we have accepted being there permanently?

Well the point is the cost of staying around London would have Been 3 times more than here and the head lease value is twice the cost of the loan

Attendance is actually higher. I think that’s the point

 

[CCFC54321]

Well at least not by force but ultimately Richardson can take them wherever he likes or dispose of them

If the owner wants their model to work they simply need to go home. It hasn’t worked and never will work in Coventry.

They (London wasps) are toxic.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

If the owner wants their model to work they simply need to go home. It hasn’t worked and never will work in Coventry.

They (London wasps) are toxic.

He'll have his eyes mostly on the non sporting side

 

[Grendel]

If the owner wants their model to work they simply need to go home. It hasn’t worked and never will work in Coventry.

They (London wasps) are toxic.

You really are a bit simple aren’t you

 

[CCFC54321]

F

You really are a bit simple aren’t you

Fuck off you mouthy gob shite prick.

Nobody wants you on here just like that waspie. Go fuck yourself prick.

 

[CCFC54321]

He'll have his eyes mostly on the non sporting side

No business can survive like wasps losing £10m a year with £65m debt around theirs neck.

Nobody listens to Grendel as he hasn’t a clue how a business model works even if he had a brain cell the clueless wasps loving tit.

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

No business can’t survive like wasps losing £10m a year with £65m debt around theirs neck.

Nobody listens to Grendel as he hasn’t a clue how a business model works even if he had a brain cell the clueless wasps loving tit.

Well they're separate things-the sports side is the huge loss leader but the rest is relatively OK. If he dissolved or relocated the rugby, then continued to charge the football club a healthy rent some of his problems disappear.

 

[Grendel]

No business can survive like wasps losing £10m a year with £65m debt around theirs neck.

Nobody listens to Grendel as he hasn’t a clue how a business model works even if he had a brain cell the clueless wasps loving tit.

How does ccfc business model work then?

 

[Grendel]

F

Fuck off you mouthy gob shite prick.

Nobody wants you on here just like that waspie. Go fuck yourself prick.

Excellent business analysis. You really know your stuff.

 

[chiefdave]

Well the point is the cost of staying around London would have Been 3 times more than here and the head lease value is twice the cost of the loan

Attendance is actually higher. I think that’s the point

by that logic its ok to move clubs around the country as long as they move somewhere cheaper. Personally I'm against clubs being moved full stop, I don't really care if their attendances go up or their costs go down as a result of moving.

 

[MacReady]

Explain why ? …. is that because historically football clubs are associated with a town or city. The mentality of football supporters is very much territorial …. That’s not always the case with rugby clubs, many clubs are associated with a town or city …. But the history of some rugby clubs is different.

I think if many of you are honest if Wasps hadn’t moved to the Ricoh but another stadium locally that hadn’t had an impact on CCFC, this thread wouldn’t exist. It’s the fact that Wasps came to the Ricoh that aggravated you not that they came to Cov, although I don’t expect for one moment anyone would admit that.

And the fact we have our own Rugby club in Coventry. So, yes, I would mind you being here. It says a lot about a club when they are happy to uproot and move across the country permanently. Clearly you’re not bothered about where you’re based or have any meaningful history whereas we are COVENTRY. And we are based in COVENTRY. The hint is in the title.

 

[Grendel]

by that logic its ok to move clubs around the country as long as they move somewhere cheaper. Personally I'm against clubs being moved full stop, I don't really care if their attendances go up or their costs go down as a result of moving.

But that’s not really the discussion

 

[chiefdave]

Well they're separate things-the sports side is the huge loss leader but the rest is relatively OK. If he dissolved or relocated the rugby, then continued to charge the football club a healthy rent some of his problems disappear.

Isn't that a problem though? Don't you then have the potential for a future owner who is only really interested in the venue & exhibition side of things and couldn't care less about owning a rugby club. What happens then, because I don't see how an owner like that would have much incentive to keep pumping millions in every year to cover losses.

How does the business model stack up if the rugby club is sold to a third party and separated from the rest of the group?

 

[chiefdave]

But that’s not really the discussion

Well it was, our new friend was claiming that as their wasn't uproar at Wasps temporary move to Wycombe a move to Coventry shouldn't be questioned. His point was nothing to do with how it would impact their finances.

My response to him was pointing out that the move to Adams Park was always said to be temporary pending a move back to London, as with our moves to Northampton and Birmingham. It was never this is just a stop off on the way to moving halfway across the country.

If SISU had moved us to Bury because there was a ground available on the cheap while we were in Birmginahm I doubt many people on here would have been claiming it was a great business deal and all fine as long as the attendances at Bury were similar to those at St Andrews.

so …… a 28 mile move to Adam’s Park outside of London is allowed but an 82 mile move is not allowed. ….. what would you suggest is the limit of an acceptable move for a rugby team ?

 

[Grendel]

Well it was, our new friend was claiming that as their wasn't uproar at Wasps temporary move to Wycombe a move to Coventry shouldn't be questioned. His point was nothing to do with how it would impact their finances.

My response to him was pointing out that the move to Adams Park was always said to be temporary pending a move back to London, as with our moves to Northampton and Birmingham. It was never this is just a stop off on the way to moving halfway across the country.

If SISU had moved us to Bury because there was a ground available on the cheap while we were in Birmginahm I doubt many people on here would have been claiming it was a great business deal and all fine as long as the attendances at Bury were similar to those at St Andrews.

The discussion is really now on wasps finances and the bond and the sub lease. They’ve been here since 2014 - semantics have long gone

 

[Brighton Sky Blue]

Isn't that a problem though? Don't you then have the potential for a future owner who is only really interested in the venue & exhibition side of things and couldn't care less about owning a rugby club. What happens then, because I don't see how an owner like that would have much incentive to keep pumping millions in every year to cover losses.

How does the business model stack up if the rugby club is sold to a third party and separated from the rest of the group?

Well that's my point, if Richardson really just wants his financial headache sorting he'd bin off the rugby club ASAP. Though he by all accounts does care enough about it not to ever do that.

 

[Gynnsthetonic]

Well that's my point, if Richardson really just wants his financial headache sorting he'd bin off the rugby club ASAP. Though he by all accounts does care enough about it not to ever do that.

He can't do it much longer though, he doesn't have that amount of cash to keep bankrolling Wasps

 

[chiefdave]

Well that's my point, if Richardson really just wants his financial headache sorting he'd bin off the rugby club ASAP. Though he by all accounts does care enough about it not to ever do that.

The concern for Wasps is the next owner of the group may not feel the same way.

 

[Grendel]

The concern for Wasps is the next owner of the group may not feel the same way.

Well I think a sub lease on a peppercorn rent will be more attractive than building a ground - where is Richardson going anyway

 

[Dubai-Dodger]

And the fact we have our own Rugby club in Coventry. So, yes, I would mind you being here. It says a lot about a club when they are happy to uproot and move across the country permanently. Clearly you’re not bothered about where you’re based or have any meaningful history whereas we are COVENTRY. And we are based in COVENTRY. The hint is in the title.

You still didn’t explain anything other than spout Coventry ….. the reality is the move happened long ago and it’s history, Wasps are here, what matters now is the future, which is very much likely to involve Wasps staying in Coventry, of course you won’t welcome them but being blunt that doesn’t really have any impact.

 

[Dubai-Dodger]

My response to him was pointing out that the move to Adams Park was always said to be temporary pending a move back to London, as with our moves to Northampton and Birmingham. It was never this is just a stop off on the way to moving halfway across the country.

Different owner… different era …. Staying in London wasn’t an option for Richardson (and before anyone mentions about Brentford, Wasps couldn’t have lasted long enough to wait).