The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (160 Viewers)

[clint van damme]

I love the polish shops myself, they do great stuff like big jars of sauerkraut and that polish mayonnaise (which is superb). Some of them have good ham counters.

i work with several Poles, never known a race of people to eat so much beetroot!

 

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[skybluetony176]

I love the polish shops myself, they do great stuff like big jars of sauerkraut and that polish mayonnaise (which is superb). Some of them have good ham counters.

Same here

 

[skybluetony176]

i work with several Poles, never known a race of people to eat so much beetroot!

Mmmm. Beetroot. It’s come to me later in life I must admit but It’s an itch I can’t stop scratching.

 

[skybluetony176]

If you don't understand that then I have no idea what you are doing on a thread for a debate regarding the EU referendum. Of course you don't understand why people voted the way they did, and your arrogance gets in the way of acknowledging why this happened.

Your own exposure to a leave voter kind of confirms my points:

1) Leave voters don't think it's worth bringing up conversations with remainers through getting abuse.
2) You can't accept the vote because you are not prepared to try and understand it.

We’re a country that’s been shaped by influence since the day it was first settled by Africans following the receding ice floes. We’ve been conquered by everyone from the Romans to the Norman’s to the Saxons all of which brought their own culture here. We’ve conquered the whole world and imported their cultures.
How exactly did voting leave for cultural reasons protect a countries culture that is shaped from imported culture? Given our culture is multiculturalism and the inevitable dilution that brings surely a leave vote damages our culture not protects it as it flies in the face of our culture.

 

[wingy]

We’re a country that’s been shaped by influence since the day it was first settled by Africans following the receding ice floes. We’ve been conquered by everyone from the Romans to the Norman’s to the Saxons all of which brought their own culture here. We’ve conquered the whole world and imported their cultures.
How exactly did voting leave for cultural reasons protect a countries culture that is shaped from imported culture? Given our culture is multiculturalism and the inevitable dilution that brings surely a leave vote damages our culture not protects it as it flies in the face of our culture.

All good points.
Not to be confused though with the infrastructure pressures and suppression of wages placed upon existing population.
Had that been tackled Correctly instead of exploited I doubt Farage would have got a hearing.

 

[martcov]

What part of European culture is so different to our own collection of European cultures that it is worth taking a potential long term economic hit for?

 

[Sick Boy]

If you don't understand that then I have no idea what you are doing on a thread for a debate regarding the EU referendum. Of course you don't understand why people voted the way they did, and your arrogance gets in the way of acknowledging why this happened.

Your own exposure to a leave voter kind of confirms my points:

1) Leave voters don't think it's worth bringing up conversations with remainers through getting abuse.
2) You can't accept the vote because you are not prepared to try and understand it.

The EU has been used as a scapegoat for a sucession of Londoncentric governments. Brexit isn't going to address their anger and the amount of immigration is unlikely to change.

 

[martcov]

Why would I try and deny it? I would never try and argue that our economy is fabulous or will be better when we leave. It probably won't, and secondly we don't actually know what is going to happen anyway.

I'm saying you are focusing on completely the wrong thing. I don't claim to speak for 17 million people, but I certainly understand the reasons and the logic behind a leave vote more than you do. You'll also find many leave voters won't discuss Brexit with remain voters largely because they are so scared of getting abuse.

For you, the economy is a bigger issue than many other things, therefore you voted remain. Most leave voters would happily take a hit on the economy to get away from the EU. That's the basics of why the referendum went the way it did.

Yes it is hard to understand that people would risk screwing the economy to get away from the EU. It is hard to understand how people know so little about the EU, or rely on things told to them about the EU from sources as dubious as Breitbart, Fria Taden, The Sun, Daily Express, Daily Mail or Nigel Farage.

 

[Kingokings204]

I see this thread has been resurrected and same old arguments. I wouldn’t mind but the report published that started this thread back up is complete tosh and doesn’t even take into account the 10b we will save from eu contributions. Let alone free trade deals with nations we currently don’t have. It’s a joke report and nice to see project fear is alive and well.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

What part of European culture is so different to our own collection of European cultures that it is worth taking a potential long term economic hit for?

Hint: It isn't necessarily European culture.

 

[martcov]

I see this thread has been resurrected and same old arguments. I wouldn’t mind but the report published that started this thread back up is complete tosh and doesn’t even take into account the 10b we will save from eu contributions. Let alone free trade deals with nations we currently don’t have. It’s a joke report and nice to see project fear is alive and well.

Yes, of course it is. As are all the other warnings from various sources. They are all wrong and Brexit is going to be a great success and we will be living in our own distinct culture on our little island off the coast of Europe. Trump will make a great deal and China cannot wait to deal with a country as big as 4 or 5 Cinese conurbations. What can possibly go wrong?

 

[Kingokings204]

Yes, of course it is. As are all the other warnings from various sources. They are all wrong and Brexit is going to be a great success and we will be living in our own distinct culture on our little island off the coast of Europe. Trump will make a great deal and China cannot wait to deal with a country as big as 4 or 5 Cinese conurbations. What can possibly go wrong?

Don’t worry I will put the report that we will badly fail in 15 years time in the same bin as an instant recession , world war 3, housing market crash and an emergency budget.

The joys of project fear.

 

[martcov]

Hint: It isn't necessarily European culture.

View attachment 8959

Our UK Muslim population comes mainly from Pakistan. Our Islamic terrorism comes mainly from home grown terrorists. Brexit will take away our reliance in some areas on EU immigrants and replace them with migrants from elsewhere.

How does that reduce non British cultural groups in the UK? Or the risk of terrorism?

 

[martcov]

Don’t worry I will put the report that we will badly fail in 15 years time in the same bin as an instant recession , world war 3, housing market crash and an emergency budget.

The joys of project fear.

Yes, mark the bin „open after Brexit has taken place“.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

We’re a country that’s been shaped by influence since the day it was first settled by Africans following the receding ice floes. We’ve been conquered by everyone from the Romans to the Norman’s to the Saxons all of which brought their own culture here. We’ve conquered the whole world and imported their cultures.
How exactly did voting leave for cultural reasons protect a countries culture that is shaped from imported culture? Given our culture is multiculturalism and the inevitable dilution that brings surely a leave vote damages our culture not protects it as it flies in the face of our culture.

If you want open borders and full globalisation, that's your opinion and that's absolutely fine. However, if it carries on this way then I don't think there will be any cultures anymore. It's just a big mix. I like other cultures, but what's wrong with Germany being German, and Italy being Italian? The EU spoils that tremendously.

I and many other millions of people take the view that our culture is slowly being diminished. Sure, we are all decedents of something or another historically, but we have also had to work very hard to progress and develop into the first world we live in today. The way things have been going certainly in my life time, has been gradually been in the wrong direction.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Our UK Muslim population comes mainly from Pakistan. Our Islamic terrorism comes mainly from home grown terrorists. Brexit will take away our reliance in some areas on EU immigrants and replace them with migrants from elsewhere.

How does that reduce non British cultural groups in the UK? Or the risk of terrorism?

We don't need migrants from elsewhere, we need to be self sufficient.

The same policies that have seen terrorists get across borders so easily are the same ones that allowed their fathers to settle here. Tighter control of the borders means we can then focus on clearing up the problems we are finding here at the moment, not adding to them.

 

[Kingokings204]

Yes, mark the bin „open after Brexit has taken place“.

I’ve marked it project fear. It’s more apt I would suggest. None of them happened. Even the pound that crashed has jumped to a higher than the before the referendum. Another fail of project fear. Hasn’t gone too well has it?

 

[martcov]

If you want open borders and full globalisation, that's your opinion and that's absolutely fine. However, if it carries on this way then I don't think there will be any cultures anymore. It's just a big mix. I like other cultures, but what's wrong with Germany being German, and Italy being Italian? The EU spoils that tremendously.

I and many other millions of people take the view that our culture is slowly being diminished. Sure, we are all decedents of something or another historically, but we have also had to work very hard to progress and develop into the first world we live in today. The way things have been going certainly in my life time, has been gradually been in the wrong direction.

I don’t want full globalisation or open borders. I am in favour of strong EU external borders.

The EU is strengthening the external borders.

The Germans are still Germans despite Schengen and years of migration. Our cultures will continue to evolve as they always have. Adding elements of other cultures as we go.

Even your new blue passport is covered by other cultures. „honi soit qui mal y pense“... „dieu et mon droit“.

The language you are reading is a massive mix of the languages of various cultures.

You think we have been going in the wrong direction, but we are, or rather the country, is wealthier than ever before. The EU has strengthened people‘s rights and introduced laws against discrimination including racism ( much to the chagrin of some people).

I am more concerned as to the distribution of wealth in many European countries and multinationals and tax dodging hedge funds than Muslims or EU migrants ( I am an EU migrant ).

Staying in the EU would at least keep the European culture on which British culture is based, as the main culture of the European continent, which should please you.

You seem to live in fear of foreigners being terrorists or of them taking „your“ culture.

 

[martcov]

I’ve marked it project fear. It’s more apt I would suggest. None of them happened. Even the pound that crashed has jumped to a higher than the before the referendum. Another fail of project fear. Hasn’t gone too well has it?

The pound was 1,40 € before Brexit and is now 1,13 €. Going great isn’t it? For me at any rate. The dollar is weaker because the US wants to improve their balance of payments by making imports more expensive and their exports cheaper. Short term fix to make Trump look good.

Let’s see what happens when Brexit takes place.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

I don’t want full globalisation or open borders. I am in favour of strong EU external borders.

The EU is strengthening the external borders.

The Germans are still Germans despite Schengen and years of migration. Our cultures will continue to evolve as they always have. Adding elements of other cultures as we go.

Even your new blue passport is covered by other cultures. „honi soit qui mal y pense“... „dieu et mon droit“.

The language you are reading is a massive mix of the languages of various cultures.

You think we have been going in the wrong direction, but we are, or rather the country, is wealthier than ever before. The EU has strengthened people‘s rights and introduced laws against discrimination including racism ( much to the chagrin of some people).

I am more concerned as to the distribution of wealth in many European countries and multinationals and tax dodging hedge funds than Muslims or EU migrants ( I am an EU migrant ).

Staying in the EU would at least keep the European culture on which British culture is based, as the main culture of the European continent, which should please you.

You seem to live in fear of foreigners being terrorists or of them taking „your“ culture.

We are not leaving Europe, we are leaving the European Union. Two different things which sadly too many people don't seem to understand.

As I said, I love Europe. I also hate the direction that the EU are trying to take it.

 

[martcov]

We are not leaving Europe, we are leaving the European Union. Two different things which sadly too many people don't seem to understand.

As I said, I love Europe. I also hate the direction that the EU are trying to take it.

Which is that? Strengthening the external borders? Tackling offshore tax dodging? Discussing how to get Africa going to avoid absolutely massive migration from a young population with little prospect of good jobs? Improving the infrastructure to increase trade and through that wealth? Fighting corruption? Protecting people’s rights? Enforcing such things as clean air regulations?

Or do you prefer a Tory government intent on deregulation and doing little or nothing for worker’s rights?

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Which is that? Strengthening the external borders? Tackling offshore tax dodging? Discussing how to get Africa going to avoid absolutely massive migration from a young population with little prospect of good jobs? Improving the infrastructure to increase trade and through that wealth? Fighting corruption? Protecting people’s rights? Enforcing such things as clean air regulations?

Or do you prefer a Tory government intent on deregulation and doing little or nothing for worker’s rights?

If you still cannot see it at this point then I'm afraid you are beyond any point of reason from me or anyone else.

I've not read such blinkered nonsense in a very long time.

 

[martcov]

If you still cannot see it at this point then I'm afraid you are beyond any point of reason from me or anyone else.

I've not read such blinkered nonsense in a very long time.

Really? Considering that you read such crap as Breitbart, Express and Fria Taden, you are hardly in the position to accuse anybody of writing blinkered nonsense or to claim that you have not read blinkered nonsense for a long time.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Really? Considering that you read such crap as Breitbart, Express and Fria Taden, you are hardly in the position to accuse anybody of writing blinkered nonsense or to claim that you have not read blinkered nonsense for a long time.

Clutching.

Straws.

 

[skybluetony176]

Hint: It isn't necessarily European culture.

View attachment 8959

Fucking hell

 

[skybluetony176]

If you want open borders and full globalisation, that's your opinion and that's absolutely fine. However, if it carries on this way then I don't think there will be any cultures anymore. It's just a big mix. I like other cultures, but what's wrong with Germany being German, and Italy being Italian? The EU spoils that tremendously.

I and many other millions of people take the view that our culture is slowly being diminished. Sure, we are all decedents of something or another historically, but we have also had to work very hard to progress and develop into the first world we live in today. The way things have been going certainly in my life time, has been gradually been in the wrong direction.

Globalisation is nothing new. We started it, look at a Victorian map of the world. It’s our culture. You have a complete failure of understanding of our history and how it’s shaped our culture.

 

[Sick Boy]

Globalisation is nothing new. We started it, look at a Victorian map of the world. It’s our culture. You have a complete failure of understanding of our history and how it’s shaped our culture.

I don't understand the notion that Brexit is going to go some way towards reversing globalisation for the UK, unless they seem to think that the UK is going to be isolating itseld away from the 21st century.

 

[martcov]

I don't understand the notion that Brexit is going to go some way towards reversing globalisation for the UK, unless they seem to think that the UK is going to be isolating itseld away from the 21st century.

May is sliming round China and has invited Trump to Britain. The USA has the most powerful multinational companies in the world and China supplies the world with virtually everything more cheaply than we can compete with. At least within the EU we had a say in regulating globalisation. Much more than we will have on our own. A market of 500 million speaking has more influence than one of 65 million starting negotiations from scratch.

Amazing that some still don’t get that.

 

[Sick Boy]

Hint: It isn't necessarily European culture.

View attachment 8959

May is sliming round China and has invited Trump to Britain. The USA has the most powerful multinational companies in the world and China supplies the world with virtually everything more cheaply than we can compete with. At least within the EU we had a say in regulating globalisation. Much more than we will have on our own. A market of 500 million speaking has more influence than one of 65 million starting negotiations from scratch.

Amazing that some still don’t get that.

Apparently the EU would plan on implementing Sharia Law in Britain if we were to stay in.

 

[martcov]

If you still cannot see it at this point then I'm afraid you are beyond any point of reason from me or anyone else.

I've not read such blinkered nonsense in a very long time.

What is this „it“ that I don’t see? Why do you post a picture of Merkel in Muslim garb? Why don’t you answer points or explain e.g. how Breitbart, Fria Taden and the Express are not „blinkered“ or known for writing nonsense? You seem frightened of other cultures and think that Muslims have a monopoly on terrorism, whilst claiming the rise of right wing violence is people understandably „taking things into their own hands“. You are enjoying the rise of the far right in Europe as they are on your wave length.

 

[martcov]

Apparently the EU would plan on implementing Sharia Law in Britain if we were to stay in.

Will have do that quickly before the EU falls apart and everyone follows Britain‘s lead to become nation states. Each with their own bureaucracy and their own armies competing with each other in each other’s markets. No freedom of movement. Survival of the fittest. What could possibly go wrong with that?

 

[clint van damme]

What is this „it“ that I don’t see? Why do you post a picture of Merkel in Muslim garb? Why don’t you answer points or explain e.g. how Breitbart, Fria Taden and the Express are not „blinkered“ or known for writing nonsense? You seem frightened of other cultures and think that Muslims have a monopoly on terrorism, whilst claiming the rise of right wing violence is people understandably „taking things into their own hands“. You are enjoying the rise of the far right in Europe as they are on your wave length.

there's no need to worry about immigration the tories have a cunning plan. They are going to make the country so shit to live in for all but the top 1% that no one will want to move here, genius!

 

[skybluetony176]

I don't understand the notion that Brexit is going to go some way towards reversing globalisation for the UK, unless they seem to think that the UK is going to be isolating itseld away from the 21st century.

If anything I think it will increase globalisation from a U.K. perspective. If the U.K. becomes an ugly choice for economic EU migrants we’ll still have to fill a quota of migrants to fill jobs traditionally done by a migrant workforce, they’ll have to come from a wider area, thus increasing globalisation and the speed it’s growing at.

 

[skybluetony176]

Apparently the EU would plan on implementing Sharia Law in Britain if we were to stay in.

For sure.

 

[Earlsdon_Skyblue1]

Fucking hell

Globalisation is nothing new. We started it, look at a Victorian map of the world. It’s our culture. You have a complete failure of understanding of our history and how it’s shaped our culture.

Fucking hell what?

I'm not talking about our history, but our future. Something that you and many other people have no problems trying to destroy.