Butts Park Arena is new home (8 Viewers)

[Moff]

Except as I said the other day there is an on cost with CCFC in regards revenue vs cost and delays in sponsorship with the negative publicity around the court case. If this drags on we will get a take it or leave it offer Wasps.

You should be on the stage. Wasps need the revenue. Tempted to say FACT, but lets face it if you had a broader intelliegnce you could work that out for yourself.

Oh and keep kidding yourself that the Sponsorship hold up is down to bad publicity.

 

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[Sick Boy]

The Wasp wankers on here are shitting themselves at the possibility there new favourite club might miss out on revenue.


Suddenly Italia and Tony have emerged from there Wasps trenches with guns firing.

It's utterly embarrassing; their primary concern appears to be ensuring that Wasps make money out of ccfc and rubbishing suggestions that the club should build our stadium.

 

[skybluetony176]

You're go go using on the 12-15k and not the 20k final.

Even 12-15k wasps can charges us £300-400k+ pa rent, sell advertising, get f&b's car parking etc. Of course they will offer us a deal to stay.


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What makes you think we'd ever reach the need to expand to 20k starting from 12-15k? It doesn't give you the scope of success to need a 20k stadium baring the chance of a multimillionaire benefactor like Bournemouth.

Start at 20k is all I'm saying. If you do anything different you're hamstringing the club and eliminating Wasps competition in one failed swoop. Why would any CCFC fan want that? Even wasps fanatic Italia isn't suggesting it.

 

[chiefdave]

You just need to look at clubs with similar size grounds and see where they are.

You mean like Bournemouth, Watford and Swansea?

 

[martcov]

They don't need to read the thread, the hard facts tell them that 12,000 is okay. If 15,000 were turning up every week they would be considering that.

Yes, but we finished Last year in our worst Position in around 50 years. We have had years of mismanagement. I hope that CA would put that into the equation. We have to plan for premiereship long term. Southampton Stoke Norwich Burnley QPR etc are no bigger than we are. We should be up with them. 25000 to 30000 average in the PL should be possible. That is the target.

 

[stupot07]

A few of us have asked for the business case, not most.
Sisu need to be aware of what we want or we may not go to a new stadium. This is an input into their business plan.
Maybe I'm a little paranoid but I hope they don't read this thread and think a 12,000 stadium is okay.

You seen being paranoid, no one thinks 12k is ok.


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[Sick Boy]

What was our averse last time we were in the PL?

 

[SkyBlue_Bear83]

I'm guessing the sponsorship hold up is partly due to the fact we haven't committed to the Ricoh long term. These sort of naming right are usually signed in 5 or 10 year deals and Coventry City add value to this. Anyone who wants to buy the naming rights to the stadium will either want guarantees from ACL that we are staying their long term or if not then they will want to negotiate a significantly lower price.

Obviously Wasps want to get as money as possible so they delay it in the hope that in the mean time they can tie down the football club to a long deal.

 

[M&B Stand]

In years to come architects will look back on the countless, soulless bowl stadiums built in England since the 90's, the same way ugly concrete 1960's shit architecture is viewed now. Even Wembley has proved to be a shocking venue for atmosphere, it was built with bullet points like 'more legroom in every seat than the old Royal box'.
Perfect space to put your Pepsi and hotdog whilst watching the NFL.

If you want a rocking terrace or unique 4 stand stadium you have go to Europe.

Go for it, build on the Butts the best way you can I say.

 

[martcov]

What was Piraten

What was our averse last time we were in the PL?

What was our ground capacity?

 

[italiahorse]

They don't need to read the thread, the hard facts tell them that 12,000 is okay. If 15,000 were turning up every week they would be considering that.

Are you a genius ?

No actually, where do we want to be ?
If it's L1 then yes it's big enough but count me out on lack of ambition.
In fact when the stadiums built in 5 years where will we be ?
If it's L1 somethings gone wrong.

 

[SimonGilbert]

Genuine question, have they released a statement on every potential site then that has been mentioned in the past?

Just found it interesting they released a statement so quickly on this particular one which doesn't fully dismiss it.

They did on this one: http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/coventry-citys-new-home-6481660

And I'm fairly sure they did about Brandon - but that was before I was covering the issue.

 

[Otis]

Given we're unlikely to get back to being PL regulars it's not likely to be a problem.

20k is only marginally smaller than HR. How do other teams manage it? The likes of QPR, Burnley, Watford when they are near the top of the championship?

Leeds and Sheffield United have massive grounds but are not looking anywhere near PL.


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The trend with clubs once they get to the Premier is to increase their capacities, rather than decrease them. You look how many Premier clubs have increased their capacities.

I'm happy to move to the Butts, but if we decrease our capacity and to this degree, which is massive, then I can't see how that is forward thinking.

We know the City, we know what sort of crowds we are well capable of. We should be looking for something that can increase to around 30,000. This will surely not ever be possible at the Butts.

The initial capacity really, really worries me. We do really well and we are going to miss out of thousands and thousands of fans wanting to get in.

A minimum for me I would say at the moment would need to be 18,000, not 12,000 - 15,000.

Wonder what the trend is these days and how many clubs are actually moving to smaller stadiums, if any at all, especially those who are ambitious!

 

[Sick Boy]

What was Piraten


What was our ground capacity?

Damn autocorrect! *average

 

[martcov]

They did on this one: http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/coventry-citys-new-home-6481660

And I'm fairly sure they did about Brandon - but that was before I was covering the issue.

Do you think Les Reid is right about the Butts site?

 

[martcov]

Damn autocorrect! *average

Same goes for 'Piraten' in my quote.

 

[SimonGilbert]

Do you think Les Reid is right about the Butts site?

Hey, he might have got a tremendous scoop. And if he has, hats off to him.

But it goes against everything the club has said publicly before, and against the guidance we sought on Chris Anderson's comments.

This all assumes a stadium is being built of course. The burden of proof for that is on the believer.

 

[stupot07]

Are you a genius ?

No actually, where do we want to be ?
If it's L1 then yes it's big enough but count me out on lack of ambition.
In fact when the stadiums built in 5 years where will we be ?
If it's L1 somethings gone wrong.

Where do you think we're going to be in 5 years time on a matchday rent only little/no access to matchday and additional revenues that will see us with one of the lowest turnovers in the championship if we get there?


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[Otis]

What makes you think we'd ever reach the need to expand to 20k starting from 12-15k? It doesn't give you the scope of success to need a 20k stadium baring the chance of a multimillionaire benefactor like Bournemouth.

Start at 20k is all I'm saying. If you do anything different you're hamstringing the club and eliminating Wasps competition in one failed swoop. Why would any CCFC fan want that? Even wasps fanatic Italia isn't suggesting it.

Starting at 20,000, or thereabouts, makes perfect sense. Starting at 12,000 -15,000 makes very little sense at all.

 

[skybluetony176]

You mean like Bournemouth, Watford and Swansea?

Yes let's. Watford and Swansea both over 20k so Bournemouth is actually the only real comparison to what SISU are suggesting and they have something we don't. A benefactor who was willing to pump money in.

Plus how much historical debt do those examples have? How much debt are they servicing from the construction of their stadium? Two of which are far superior to what SISU are proposing.

Not really examples at all are they.

 

[stupot07]

The trend with clubs once they get to the Premier is to increase their capacities, rather than decrease them. You look how many Premier clubs have increased their capacities.

I'm happy to move to the Butts, but if we decrease our capacity and to this degree, which is massive, then I can't see how that is forward thinking.

We know the City, we know what sort of crowds we are well capable of. We should be looking for something that can increase to around 30,000. This will surely not ever be possible at the Butts.

The initial capacity really, really worries me. We do really well and we are going to miss out of thousands and thousands of fans wanting to get in.

A minimum for me I would say at the moment would need to be 18,000, not 12,000 - 15,000.

Wonder what the trend is these days and how many clubs are actually moving to smaller stadiums, if any at all, especially those who are ambitious!

Unfortunately Otis, those clubs own/leasehold their stadiums. We don't have a stadium.

18k with view to increase to say 24-26k would be the ideal.


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[skybluetony176]

It's utterly embarrassing; their primary concern appears to be ensuring that Wasps make money out of ccfc and rubbishing suggestions that the club should build our stadium.

You know I always thought it was an act but it isn't. You clearly are that stupid.

 

[Sick Boy]

At the end of the day we have a far greater chance of Sisu leaving if we build our own stadium. Being held to ransom by a franchise rugby club is hardly going to be appealing to any potential investor

 

[martcov]

We will always be paying someone for the stadium. Propco/ Opco.

 

[skybluetony176]

What was our averse last time we were in the PL?

What was the average overall last time we were in the premier league? How does that compare to the average overall in the premier league now.?

 

[italiahorse]

Where do you think we're going to be in 5 years time on a matchday rent only little/no access to matchday and additional revenues that will see us with one of the lowest turnovers in the championship if we get there?
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Sorry whats the plan that will generate those incomes? I must have missed it.
The Ricoh is unlikely to do that so what's going to get us there ?
In view of no better plan I'll go for what we've got now at the Ricoh.

 

[martcov]

Yes let's. Watford and Swansea both over 20k so Bournemouth is actually the only real comparison to what SISU are suggesting and they have something we don't. A benefactor who was willing to pump money in.

Plus how much historical debt do those examples have? How much debt are they servicing from the construction of their stadium? Two of which are far superior to what SISU are proposing.

Not really examples at all are they.

No. Bournemouth, like Yeovil, are one season wonders. We are potentially bigger than several PL Teams - assuming 25000 to 30000 attendances.

 

[Otis]

Unfortunately Otis, those clubs own/leasehold their stadiums. We don't have a stadium.

18k with view to increase to say 24-26k would be the ideal.


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Agree with that. Starting at 18,000 would make sense. 24-26k makes sense too. You see, you're talking rationally. It's common sense thinking and that's what we need here.

Are there any clubs out there in the top 2 divisions who have decreased their capacities or moved to a smaller ground?

 

[italiahorse]

Unfortunately Otis, those clubs own/leasehold their stadiums. We don't have a stadium.

18k with view to increase to say 24-26k would be the ideal.


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Who will own the new stadium ? What will our rent be ? What incomes will the stadium owners let us have access to ?

 

[Jack Griffin]

They did on this one: http://www.coventrytelegraph.net/news/coventry-news/coventry-citys-new-home-6481660

And I'm fairly sure they did about Brandon - but that was before I was covering the issue.

A change of direction every year then.

I thought for a minute Anderson was setting a clear course with his opening statements, but as usual with SISU here is another failed strategy masked by smoke & mirrors.

 

[skybluetony176]

At the end of the day we have a far greater chance of Sisu leaving if we build our own stadium. Being held to ransom by a franchise rugby club is hardly going to be appealing to any potential investor

No we won't. We'll have a club with a mountain of historical debt, fresh debt from a stadium build and an inferior stadium at that which gives little to zero chance of ever paying that debt of. How's that appealing?

 

[Jack Griffin]

Yes let's. Watford and Swansea both over 20k so Bournemouth is actually the only real comparison to what SISU are suggesting and they have something we don't. A benefactor who was willing to pump money in.

Plus how much historical debt do those examples have? How much debt are they servicing from the construction of their stadium? Two of which are far superior to what SISU are proposing.

Not really examples at all are they.

Cherries are planning to expand their 12K capacity stadium to 18K, currently, the 12,000 limit is the lowest in the Championship.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30169243

 

[Nick]

The initial capacity really, really worries me. We do really well and we are going to miss out of thousands and thousands of fans wanting to get in.

We are doing really well at the minute though, 15k would be enough I think.

Then if we got to the Championship it could be increased.

It is down to ease of additional capacity that it could be done in a pre season if we got promoted.

I don't think it is happening, but wouldn't mind 15k for League one on the basis it was easily upgraded based on promotions.

 

[Huckerby]

So just to confirm, nobody believes this is happening right

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[stupot07]

Sorry whats the plan that will generate those incomes? I must have missed it.
The Ricoh is unlikely to do that so what's going to get us there ?
In view of no better plan I'll go for what we've got now at the Ricoh.

We will still be at the Ricoh for another 8-10 years even if we build a new stadium, you keep talking about lack of aspirations so, I'm asking you where you think we will be in 5 years time at the Ricoh under a similar arrangements to what we have now?



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