Coronavirus Thread (Off Topic, Politics) (158 Viewers)

chiefdave · Aug 22, 2020

Germany have extended their furlough scheme for 24 months. German finance minister, Olaf Scholz said “The corona crisis won’t suddenly disappear in the next few weeks. Businesses and employees need a clear signal from the government: we’ve got your back for the long haul in this crisis, so that no one is being let go without need.”

Germany to extend coronavirus furlough to 24 months

Angela Merkel backs proposal to continue Kurzarbeit part-time working scheme

www.theguardian.com

Using government figures to extend the scheme to 24 months here would cost a total of £336bn, although you would expect the monthly cost to decrease over time as more people go back to work. We spent £500bn bailing out the banks without batting an eyelid.

wingy · Aug 22, 2020

The argument that numbers are rising due to the increase in testing seems to be being made more.

wingy · Aug 22, 2020

Meanwhile.

'Don’t fear second wave - virus is getting less angry' says medic

The intensive care consultant, who works at University Hospitals Birmingham NHS Foundation Trust hospitals, says poorly patients are not increasing despite rise in infections

www.birminghammail.co.uk

.

Plus some restrictions introduced in Birmingham.

xcraigx · Aug 22, 2020

wingy said:
The argument that numbers are rising due to the increase in testing seems to be being made more.

Yes, I've been hearing this a bit recently. I suppose it depends on the timescales being used. Testing has noticeably risen compared to say June and July but the amount of testing has been very similar throughout all of August so I'm not sure that's actually correct. We are seeing a slight increase in cases.

Deleted member 5849 · Aug 22, 2020

xcraigx said:
Yes, I've been hearing this a bit recently. I suppose it depends on the timescales being used. Testing has noticeably risen compared to say June and July but the amount of testing has been very similar throughout all of August so I'm not sure that's actually correct. We are seeing a slight increase in cases.

tbh as people socialise more, it's inevitable cases rise - that surely can't be argued!

It's whether they rise too much or not. atm, it's looking ominous. it had better hold off for a while yet though, don't want to be cancelling my sodding wedding *again*!

wingy · Aug 22, 2020

Deleted member 5849 said:
tbh as people socialise more, it's inevitable cases rise - that surely can't be argued!

It's whether they rise too much or not. atm, it's looking ominous. it had better hold off for a while yet though, don't want to be cancelling my sodding wedding *again*!

Come on .
Time to jump over that broomstick.
Good luck.

Sky_Blue_Dreamer · Aug 22, 2020

Deleted member 5849 said:
tbh as people socialise more, it's inevitable cases rise - that surely can't be argued!

It's whether they rise too much or not. atm, it's looking ominous. it had better hold off for a while yet though, don't want to be cancelling my sodding wedding *again*!

I agree it's looking a bit ominous but I am pleased that deaths/hospital admissions are staying low, suggesting the virus might be becoming less lethal and we can afford to loosen up a bit.

Still wary on how it might be in the colder months when flu etc goes around and how the two together could cause problems for people, or indeed how flu may be with those that have had and recovered from Covid, esp those that had it quite severely and may have suffered lung damage from it. Also even with a weakened strain the effect it may have on older and more vulnerable people during a time of the year when the immune system is more compromised.

Deleted member 5849 · Aug 22, 2020

Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
suggesting the virus might be becoming less lethal and we can afford to loosen up a bit.

That tallies, though, with the things being loosened up being the things people younger are able to cope with more (pubs etc.). now that's fine... but what we don't want, is them then spreading it elsewhere and having collatoral damage.

Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Still wary on how it might be in the colder months when flu etc goes around and how the two together could cause problems for people, or indeed how flu may be with those that have had and recovered from Covid, esp those that had it quite severely and may have suffered lung damage from it. Also even with a weakened strain the effect it may have on older and more vulnerable people during a time of the year when the immune system is more compromised.

The test will be come late September onwards, really. If that's still looking good, happy days. if not, we need to row back, and fast.

Deleted member 4439 · Aug 22, 2020

chiefdave said:
Germany have extended their furlough scheme for 24 months. German finance minister, Olaf Scholz said “The corona crisis won’t suddenly disappear in the next few weeks. Businesses and employees need a clear signal from the government: we’ve got your back for the long haul in this crisis, so that no one is being let go without need.”

Germany to extend coronavirus furlough to 24 months

Angela Merkel backs proposal to continue Kurzarbeit part-time working scheme

www.theguardian.com

Using government figures to extend the scheme to 24 months here would cost a total of £336bn, although you would expect the monthly cost to decrease over time as more people go back to work. We spent £500bn bailing out the banks without batting an eyelid.

But we all pay for it, either in terms of reduced services, higher taxes, lower wages. I can't expect people's hearts to bleed for me but in the civil service we've taken a real terms 20% pay and pension cut over the last 8 years.

wingy · Aug 22, 2020

Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
I agree it's looking a bit ominous but I am pleased that deaths/hospital admissions are staying low, suggesting the virus might be becoming less lethal and we can afford to loosen up a bit.

Still wary on how it might be in the colder months when flu etc goes around and how the two together could cause problems for people, or indeed how flu may be with those that have had and recovered from Covid, esp those that had it quite severely and may have suffered lung damage from it. Also even with a weakened strain the effect it may have on older and more vulnerable people during a time of the year when the immune system is more compromised.

Haven't had a flu vaccination invite yet.

chiefdave · Aug 22, 2020

dubed said:
But we all pay for it, either in terms of reduced services, higher taxes, lower wages. I can't expect people's hearts to bleed for me but in the civil service we've taken a real terms 20% pay and pension cut over the last 8 years.

It's the same everywhere. I'm private sector and have had one pay increase since 2008! Equates to a 22% pay cut over that time.

Guess the argument is paying out for furlough is better for the economy than having millions unemployed. I've looked at my situation and if I don't go back to work before the furlough scheme ends what I'd be entitled to wouldn't even cover my mortgage. I'd be completely screwed and there will be millions in the same position.

chiefdave · Aug 22, 2020

wingy said:
Haven't had a flu vaccination invite yet.

You can book them online for Lloyds Chemists and they don't charge you if you meet the NHS criteria.

Ian1779 · Aug 22, 2020

Deleted member 5849 said:
That tallies, though, with the things being loosened up being the things people younger are able to cope with more (pubs etc.). now that's fine... but what we don't want, is them then spreading it elsewhere and having collatoral damage.

The test will be come late September onwards, really. If that's still looking good, happy days. if not, we need to row back, and fast.

2/3 weeks into the new school term we will learn a lot about how kids contribute to the virus spreading. I am crossing everything to hope it’s not an issue but I am ominous about it.

Deleted member 5849 · Aug 22, 2020

Ian1779 said:
2/3 weeks into the new school term we will learn a lot about how kids contribute to the virus spreading. I am crossing everything to hope it’s not an issue but I am ominous about it.

Think it might take a bit longer to kick in tbh but yeah, big tests ahead!

Sky_Blue_Dreamer · Aug 22, 2020

Ian1779 said:
2/3 weeks into the new school term we will learn a lot about how kids contribute to the virus spreading. I am crossing everything to hope it’s not an issue but I am ominous about it.

Will teachers etc being getting tested much?

Ian1779 · Aug 22, 2020

Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Will teachers etc being getting tested much?

No idea to be honest - we’ve not been told anything about this from either school or union. There was talk a couple of weeks ago about weekly/fortnightly tests but nothing has come through further on that.

I do want the schools back open, but there are a few simple things that could go in place to support this such as temp checks at start of school, masks for adults when kids at lunch/break. Little things that could go a long way to reduce inevitable spread in schools.

Lets see what comes through this week.....

Saddlebrains · Aug 22, 2020

'Coronavirus getting less angry' says Mids doctor

Dr Ron Daniels is an intensivist based at Good Hope Hospital

www.coventrytelegraph.net

Adding more fuel to the fire. It's not what it was

fernandopartridge · Aug 24, 2020

Saddlebrains said:
'Coronavirus getting less angry' says Mids doctor

Dr Ron Daniels is an intensivist based at Good Hope Hospital

www.coventrytelegraph.net

Adding more fuel to the fire. It's not what it was

Florida in the USA was saying this mid summer, cases were up with no hospitalisation and few deaths, it was only cos the average age of those infected was much lower. Eventually it started to spread to the more vulnerable and the hospitals filled up and deaths went up.

David O'Day · Aug 24, 2020

Coronavirus: Staff and pupils test positive in Dundee school outbreak

All staff and students have been told to self-isolate, while contact tracing has identified further cases.

news.sky.com

chiefdave · Aug 24, 2020

David O'Day said:
Coronavirus: Staff and pupils test positive in Dundee school outbreak

All staff and students have been told to self-isolate, while contact tracing has identified further cases.

news.sky.com

Haven't got kids but if I did having seen how many issues there have been in a week of schools being open in Scotland and listened to how carefully Harries was choosing her words this morning talking about "the risk to the child themselves" there's no way I'd be sending them back. Not to mention the huge difference between the preparations to make schools safe in other countries compared to here where virtually nothing seems to have been done.

Saddlebrains · Aug 24, 2020

chiefdave said:
Haven't got kids but if I did having seen how many issues there have been in a week of schools being open in Scotland and listened to how carefully Harries was choosing her words this morning talking about "the risk to the child themselves" there's no way I'd be sending them back. Not to mention the huge difference between the preparations to make schools safe in other countries compared to here where virtually nothing seems to have been done.

But what about childrens education? They've been off for 6 months. Im not slating your opinion btw i just feel we have to have schools back. Any more time away from education and friends and we will have a generation of mental illness through the roof

Sky Blue Pete · Aug 24, 2020

Saddlebrains said:
But what about childrens education? They've been off for 6 months. Im not slating your opinion btw i just feel we have to have schools back. Any more time away from education and friends and we will have a generation of mental illness through the roof

Happy it has to happen but we need a clear plan that everyone follows when infections start to happen

wingy · Aug 24, 2020

What about shielding parents?.

wingy · Aug 24, 2020

How are they meant to get there
Bus/Coach companies making redundancies and administrations.

chiefdave · Aug 24, 2020

Saddlebrains said:
But what about childrens education? They've been off for 6 months. Im not slating your opinion btw i just feel we have to have schools back. Any more time away from education and friends and we will have a generation of mental illness through the roof

Personally I don't have any confidence that the government has properly examined the evidence and carefully considered the balance between education requirements, mental health and the risk of spreading the virus. Maybe someone who works in education will post and tell us of measures being put in place to ensure safety and a plan to deal with any outbreaks.

Sky Blue Pete · Aug 24, 2020

chiefdave said:
Personally I don't have any confidence that the government has properly examined the evidence and carefully considered the balance between education requirements, mental health and the risk of spreading the virus. Maybe someone who works in education will post and tell us of measures being put in place to ensure safety and a plan to deal with any outbreaks.

That’s very unlikely isn’t it

Brighton Sky Blue · Aug 24, 2020

chiefdave said:
Personally I don't have any confidence that the government has properly examined the evidence and carefully considered the balance between education requirements, mental health and the risk of spreading the virus. Maybe someone who works in education will post and tell us of measures being put in place to ensure safety and a plan to deal with any outbreaks.

Each class stays in the same room all day with teachers moving between them. I am not allowed to go beyond a designated area at the front of the room and if I want to hand anything out it has to be done from the front going back. Practicals can only be done sparingly as the lab must be deep cleaned after use which in effect means that practicals are off the cards for the most part. Homework is being set online to minimise contact with students books and work.

Lunch and break are at staggered times so that students and teachers can have their packed lunches in designated areas. Additional duties are in place for teachers to make sure year groups remain in their bubbles. If a student presents Covid symptoms in a lesson they have to go to reception immediately and if students are absent due to Covid I have to record myself on a headset.

In essence it is minimal disruption for the kids and maximum for the staff.

dutchman · Aug 24, 2020

Saddlebrains said:
But what about childrens education? They've been off for 6 months. Im not slating your opinion btw i just feel we have to have schools back. Any more time away from education and friends and we will have a generation of mental illness through the roof

The government doesn't care about any of that, they just want the parents back at work and paying taxes.

Brighton Sky Blue · Aug 24, 2020

Saddlebrains said:
But what about childrens education? They've been off for 6 months. Im not slating your opinion btw i just feel we have to have schools back. Any more time away from education and friends and we will have a generation of mental illness through the roof

My personal view is that either everyone should go back to school without bubbles or distancing, or it should all continue remotely. The halfway house measures are just unworkable

Saddlebrains · Aug 24, 2020

Brighton Sky Blue said:
My personal view is that either everyone should go back to school without bubbles or distancing, or it should all continue remotely. The halfway house measures are just unworkable

I would agree with that. But i would go further and say we do that for everything. Lock it down or crack on.I will get abuse for that im sure

shmmeee · Aug 24, 2020

Brighton Sky Blue said:
Each class stays in the same room all day with teachers moving between them. I am not allowed to go beyond a designated area at the front of the room and if I want to hand anything out it has to be done from the front going back. Practicals can only be done sparingly as the lab must be deep cleaned after use which in effect means that practicals are off the cards for the most part. Homework is being set online to minimise contact with students books and work.

Lunch and break are at staggered times so that students and teachers can have their packed lunches in designated areas. Additional duties are in place for teachers to make sure year groups remain in their bubbles. If a student presents Covid symptoms in a lesson they have to go to reception immediately and if students are absent due to Covid I have to record myself on a headset.

In essence it is minimal disruption for the kids and maximum for the staff.

Jesus, I wouldn’t fancy that.

Brighton Sky Blue · Aug 24, 2020

Saddlebrains said:
I would agree with that. But i would go further and say we do that for everything. Lock it down or crack on.I will get abuse for that im sure

Not far away from now people will start getting colds and the flu, which in schools spread pretty quickly. In likelihood cold or flu probably causes more harm on average to a child than Covid does. We never used to insist on such measures for the viruses that have been with us for many years and which present clear and obvious symptoms in most who catch them, including norovirus. Now a disease arrives where the vast majority of cases present with no symptoms at all and we are insisting on all types of control measures. Either scrap them all or stay in full and proper lockdown.

Brighton Sky Blue · Aug 24, 2020

shmmeee said:
Jesus, I wouldn’t fancy that.

I have been offered a visor if I insist on being able to help students from anywhere except the front. I don’t even wear one of those for experiments.

Sky_Blue_Dreamer · Aug 24, 2020

Is there any research on how cold/flu with coronavirus affects people? Or those that have had and recovered from coronavirus?

Brighton Sky Blue · Aug 24, 2020

Sky_Blue_Dreamer said:
Is there any research on how cold/flu with coronavirus affects people? Or those that have had and recovered from coronavirus?

Those who have been hospitalised with Covid have tended to take longer times to recover their lung capacity than pneumonia patients I think. If you caught both at the same time I have no idea what would happen.

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