Wouldn't this start WW3? And a nuclear war.
I am not pretending in any way I know the answer to any of this.
China too. Them abstaining rather than vote with Russia in the week is a big statement on it’s own. Then there’s the assumption that China actually likes Russia. There’s a lot of history between them and it’s not all amicable by any stretch. Then there’s the fact that China’s economy is it’s most important thing to it’s ruling class and actually Russia is not a big player in it, the reality is that Russia’s economy on the world stage ain’t that impressive. Is it really worth China’s energy to back a country with an economy about the same size of Spain and isolate itself from the rest of the world and market in the process. People keep saying Taiwan. I can’t help but think that China has been in a position for decades where financially and logistically it’s more than capable of invading and taking Taiwan. I suspect it’s growing economy and wealth trump ideology.What's interesting is when nations like Sweden and Switzerland are getting involved maybe the picture is bigger than people would like to believe.
I was referring to Evo, better luck next time
Agree with all this, except I am not sure Putin will go into another country quickly.I don't get all this what if is was Africa, what if it was China etc.
I think what the Chinese are doing to the Uighars is absolutely disgusting and would love to see us do something, but I think the only thing we could do is to boycott trade with them and hope sanctions are agreed upon by an official body.
Russia have actually invaded another country. It's something completely different isn't it and we can only deal with the here and now and I think it was Tizsa, he is quite right, it does affect your thinking when it's closer to home and not some far away place.
I did know of Charles Taylor.
This whole Ukrainian thing is just f*cked up though and we are sitting here and watching the whole thing unfold.
I really wish we could do something. I think Putin knows we won't and I am worried as to which country will be next. He has a desire to take back all the countries that gained their independence back in the 1990's.
I find the whole situation, disgusting, upsetting and quite bemusing too.
And don't ask me what I would do, because I honestly don't know, but I feel we should be doing something.More than what we are.
Yeah, it’s a ridiculous notion.I simply think this idea of giving up Ukraine with the thought that Putin in good faith will co-operate afterwards is mad. He isn’t a rational actor, that much is very clear
The aggression is unwarranted , I don't want to hand Ukraine over to Russia, I'm saying what I think is most likely to happen and probably will eventually happen .
The name calling really isn't necessary
No because Russia won't use nuclear weapons as it will end in them being destroyed as well. They still understand MAD
It's the way ur coming across all on a hyped up flex. I'm not trying to get one over on u.
I can accept nobody wants it to happen and the insults at you are out of order. However-the world is at a point where serious war is going to become unavoidable if one country uses the nuclear deterrent as a shield to invade others.
Allowing Ukraine to be taken over would be all the encouragement he needs to do it in other places.
I think this is right. He would want it as a buffer state like Belarus and like places like Romania and Poland were in the past.Not sure he wants to annex all of the Ukraine. He'll take the 2 new separatist states but put in a new pro-moscow govt for the rest.
So you know more then every western leader?
Yeah, it’s a ridiculous notion.
Didn't say you were, just pointing out I was referring to Evo who has said Ukraine should surrender.
Any way, peace out
Where on Earth have I made that claim
But they had democratic elections in 2014 and 2018 where the winners wanted to maintain good relations with Russia whilst developing relations with EU - which at the time was not a military force. It only reignited interest in joining NATO following the Russian invasion in 2014.What they want , how Ukraine can remain an independent sovereign nation ? The alternative is to see it swallowed up by Russia and not exist , there's also a danger of civil war to discuss as there are many pro Russian Ukrainians..it's a strange region
One thing is certain , there wont be a western planted government in Russia like afghan and iraq
You said if we let him take Ukraine others are at threat. I can assure you the western leaders are not looking at it like that
Many of who are fighting the Russians including ethnic Russian opposition politicians. One was on C4 news the other day, AK in reach. Ethnicity had no bearings on his beliefs, he believes in Ukraine and believes he’s Ukrainian and stands shoulder to shoulder with his president.Almost 20 % of Ukrainians are ethnically Russian
But they had democratic elections in 2014 and 2018 where the winners wanted to maintain good relations with Russia whilst developing relations with EU - which at the time was not a military force. It only reignited interest in joining NATO following the Russian invasion in 2014.
How do you have an independent sovereign nation which is not allowed to do what its people want?
China too. Them abstaining rather than vote with Russia in the week is a big statement on it’s own. Then there’s the assumption that China actually likes Russia. There’s a lot of history between them and it’s not all amicable by any stretch. Then there’s the fact that China’s economy is it’s most important thing to it’s ruling class and actually Russia is not a big player in it, the reality is that Russia’s economy on the world stage ain’t that impressive. Is it really worth China’s energy to back a country with an economy about the same size of Spain and isolate itself from the rest of the world and market in the process. People keep saying Taiwan. I can’t help but think that China has been in a position for decades where financially and logistically it’s more than capable of invading and taking Taiwan. I suspect it’s growing economy and wealth trump ideology.
China could yet end up being peacemaker here.
Many of who are fighting the Russians including ethnic Russian opposition politicians. One was on C4 news the other day, AK in reach. Ethnicity had no bearings on his beliefs, he believes in Ukraine and believes he’s Ukrainian and stands shoulder to shoulder with his president.
Would Western leaders deploy their forces to fight him if he invaded Moldova after a successful conquest of Ukraine? He would simply use the nuclear threat again because it worked the first time.
Isolationism seems to be your preferred strategy and it’s ultimately as risky as trying to squash this invasion in the early stages
The west will not do anything in Ukraine so either you know more than the collective military strategists in the whole of the west or you don’t
Which is it as they will not do anything.
Assumptions made they are close seem to be based on political history ( which no longer apply). It's more an informal collaboration to stymie the Americans. Both are about self- interest and not getting involved in each others business. China's interests are far more global than Russia's.China too. Them abstaining rather than vote with Russia in the week is a big statement on it’s own. Then there’s the assumption that China actually likes Russia.
Don't think anyone thinks the "west" is getting boots on the ground. Been stated too many times.I personally agree with grendel here , I don't see the west intervening with its military.
Please don't put me on ignore for having a differing opinion about what might happen @Brighton Sky Blue
Used them with impunity in Syria and "got away" with it. So aren't going to be worried about using them now.
Assumptions made they are close seem to be based on political history ( which no longer apply). It's more an informal collaboration to stymie the Americans. Both are about self- interest and not getting involved in each others business. China's interests are far more global than Russia's.
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