Astute
Well-Known Member
Yes you never said anything about Tuna and Prawns.
Have fun. Had enough of this pro EU propaganda bullshit.
The EU: In, out, shake it all about.... (27 Viewers)
- Thread starter jimmyhillsfanclub
- Start date
Have fun. Had enough of this pro EU propaganda bullshit.
Sick Boy
Super Moderator
This is comical and a massive waste of time with you making stuff up constantly, once again, point out where I said the UK gets tuna and prawns from the EU?
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Ha ha ha ha ha. It quotes facts, timelines and events. All of which you can fact check for yourself. It’s hardly an opinion piece.
O don’t see any problem with all countries charging similar taxes. Stops countries like Luxemburg cheating. Do you really think the savings in Europe for a trillion dollar company are just a few million?
Yes, usual pollocks. He’s fallen hook line and sinker for UKIP bullshit.
What truth are you coming out with? People constantly quote things back and give you links. You just say they are biased, twisting your truths or else you put words into their mouth to make it look as the have said something wrong.
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
We’ve all been saying the same thing. All you have to do is reply to one of us with some facts and it’s game over. Fact is the U.K. fleet lost more water to the Cod wars than any other factor. Because of this 90% of all Cod eaten in the U.K. is imported from non-EU sources. The sovereign government divy outs the fishing quotas for the U.K. and the largest recipients of that are ships registered in the U.K. but owned by other EU and Non EU countries, that’s our government letting down our fishing industry. The smaller independent, family owned, locally owned trawlers are divied out only 4% of the British quotas by the British government. A lot of the so called solutions that Brexit is going to deliver are already there should our government wish to do it.
No. You would see that UKIP, Murdoch, Dacre, Banks, Farage, Rees Mogg and so on have done a brilliant job. Steve Bannon must be impressed. Looking forward to even more bullshit as the Brexit disaster ( for the many ) nears.
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skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Any post Brexit tax cuts will be corporate and for higher rate earners. There may be a token raising of the threshold for what you start paying tax from but that’s always been disproportionately set compared to things like the rising cost of living so in real terms won’t be a tax cut at all for the lowest earning tax payers. It’s another con.
skybluetom
Member
Good to see this is still going strong, been literally 2 years since I've been on here and everybody is just as united as the day after the ref
Be interesting what happens now. Can't see any type of Brexit getting through the commons as it stands because of the numbers involved. Either another ref or a general election appears to be the only way forward as whatever plan we go with needs a democractic stamp on in my opinion.
Be interesting what happens now. Can't see any type of Brexit getting through the commons as it stands because of the numbers involved. Either another ref or a general election appears to be the only way forward as whatever plan we go with needs a democractic stamp on in my opinion.
skybluetom
Member
The whole thing is a total mess if we're honest. I did actually vote Brexit as it transpired; mainly because I've always throught trying to govern 28 (and growing) totally seperate, totally different, independant nations was always going to be impossible. It's got far too big, and is totally different from the common market we signed up for. That said, I did consider voting remain 'coz of the idiots running this country. Cameron never expected to get a majority in 2015, obviously expected to be in bed with the liberals again who would've never allowed the ref. Then he never expected leave to win so nothing was planned in the event of that happening. Then he did one! Then May totally took the 17 election for granted, expected a 100 seat majority by all accounts. Now we're in total chaos. May changes her tune every 5 minutes, Corbyn is an arch leaver but won't say it because he knows the majority of the party are remainers, and he knows many of the young he has inspired to join to party are also remain. He won't oppose the Tories on brexit because he wants them to do it, then he can take the reins and say "It's done now and if it's a mess it's the Tories fault." We're just bumbling, quite directionless from disaster to disaster at the minute.
Houchens Head
Fairly well known member from Malvern
Can't believe this thread is still running! It's as bad as that bleedin' "Portsmouth - what the …." thread!
Captain Dart
Well-Known Member
4 pages since I last looked at it..3 days ago..
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Although we have whittled away a bit at the original agreement from the EU. The fisheries policy was based upon 1970s fishing catches in EU waters. Until mid-70s most British fleets fished Icelandic waters...so we got the shitty end of the stick & are still trying to wipe it off!
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
The fact that in 2017 we imported £3.21bn & exported £1.89bn tells us all we need to know. Parity based upon demand for catches & subsequent local processing is all we want/need rather than some madcap scheme based deliberately upon catches in EU waters in a decade where half of the UK fleet's activity was outside of EU waters.
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Funnily enough (linking to another topic of the moment) I read somewhere that EU countries are themselves responsible for monitoring compliance on catches with occasional EU inspections...& it is estimated 1/3-1/2 of catches are illegal in member states (in fairness that may include our own) which suggests to me that locally a blind eye approach is applied. As-in, the EU is great at making rules. Which is about where the EU stops being great because it doesn't have the inclination/means/resource(?) to enforce the buggers!
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
I might be wrong, but that 9% I think applies only to Cod in the English Channel...still scandalous though
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Funnily enough I know someone who was involved in the Global & EU discussions on fishing policy during that spell. Globally...all was plain sailing (pardon the pun). There was much EU bullying tactics employed on voting after hours & hours of what was described as petty bickering & ego-tripping.
I imagine in reality that is only the equivalent of the Parliament 'Whips', but helps explain why it is (like so many issues in the EU) so contentious
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
What he is failing to accept (still) is that Luxembourg broke the EU Corporation Tax rules, as he highlights in his post. If post-Brexit as a non-EU member the UK decides to do likewise it is choosing to do so of it's own accord & not being dictated to by Brussels.
Which is kind of the principle what the people of the UK voted for when deciding to leave.
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
Fact: the majority of people who could be arsed/felt sufficiently compelled to vote voted to leave the EU.
GAME OVER!
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Value of various types of fish? Origin of fish? Types of fish?
Obviously not. No one has reached agreement on what leave is and whether it will be good for us or not. Anyone who believes we have taken back control is deluded. The USA says we.must wait until they have a deal with the EU, China says if we send war ships into „their“ waters we can forget a deal. Ireland, or any other EU country, can veto any NI border deal. The DUP can also scupper a deal by ending the agreement with May. No deal will get through without a second vote, or an election. If we don’t get a deal and crash out, then it is game on. Merkel and Kurz want to try to get a deal as no deal is madness. But, Merkel is „mad“ a „bitch“, a „Nazi“, oh wait.... sorry, a sensible, down to earth politician working in the interest of EU and Brexit citizens ....
One side accuses the other of bullying tactics during negotiations. That’s new.. must only happen when the EU is involved ( that is sarcasm on my part ). You imagine the negotiators are like party whips. Really? When they are negotiating with various parties who are not members of their own team in the negotiations? Do you know what a party „whip“ is and does?
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What rules did it break then? Why isn’t Luxemburg in the same trouble as Ireland then? ( edit: both are being critised and pressured )
You say the UK would lower it’s corporation tax to benefit business of it’s own accord not by Brussels dictating it to. Why would Brussels dictate that? Plus Brussels is an elected parliament, an electoral college Council and a commission of countries representatives/ commissioners, not a dictatorship. A dictat is not the word to use if the laws are issued by Brussels.
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What rules? What dictat? There is a right of veto used to fend off any action from the EU. Do you even know what a dictat is or what the word means? It is a Faragism planted in your head by the leave campaign ( same as you use „bullying tactics“ if the EU makes an argument). Sounds bad, but you don’t question it’s usage. Here is an Irish explanation in answer to criticism of Ireland‘s low corporation tax position.
Corporate tax issue rears its head again for Ireland
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Like you say originally fishing quotas were set on what was being fished and by who in EU waters in the 70’s. That system is changing ie the quotas are now based on science rather than history and the mental process of discarding is being phased out. Although the change for my liking has happened too late and too slowly so I stand by my mental assessment that the CFP although it is moving in the right direction.
Icelandic waters have never been and still aren’t under EU jurisdiction so not sure how the British fleet got the shitty end of the stick of the CFP because of that. The U.K. fleet was stopped fishing there by the UN, nothing to do with the EU what so ever.
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skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
Still doesn’t make Astute right. Also a fact. He talking sound bites from the leave campaign on fishing clearly without fact checking. The facts still don’t look good on the CFP but they’re a million miles away from what Astute has taken as gospel and ran with. You don’t need to repeat half truths and blatant lies to make the CFP look inadequate, you just need facts. You also have to acknowledge that it’s our sovereign government who divy out the quotas and it’s our government who doesn’t but the smaller family and locally owned boats first. 4% of the quota to be exact and that’s decimated local fleets as much as anything (although there is clearly more than one factor in play here). Is that likely to change post brexit? It could happen today should the government wish. Why is there going to be a change of government policy post brexit all of a sudden? The brexit effect on historical fishing communities has been wildly overplayed and over exaggerated.
SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
They got the shitty end of the stick because the quotas were based on fish caught in EU seas in the 70s...the majority of the UKs fleet fished outside of the EU waters so was simply ignored. Yes Iceland's action was not forseen by the UK or EU...but our quota was impacted by the years fishing outside EU waters from what I understand
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SkyblueBazza
Well-Known Member
I agree with you about Government...it is the same in every industry. They like small innovative businesses & entrepreneurs- but only because if it appears successful the huge corporations can buy up & cash in. They love large cumbersome beasts where cronies can lose themselves on boards & around the golf course lol
The small businessman is too busy working hard to play with them!
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chiefdave
Well-Known Member
Does this not highlight a potential issue post-Brexit with all sorts of negotiations. We will be negotiating agreement B based on our requirements with having agreement A in place. What if something then happens to agreement A?
skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
The Icelandic action happened over three decades so was forseen. We were fishing there less and less from the 50’s from the three so called Cod wars all of which Iceland won after threatening to pull out of NATO. The Cod wars was also settled by the mid 70’s so to say it wasn’t taken into consideration is a half truth at best. It’s also not what current quotas are based on so pretty irrelevant as far as fishing quotas go today.
We’ll still be tied to the EU post brexit anyway under UN law. The Irish Channel, English Channel, Large parts of the North Sea and even part of the Atlantic are shared waters under UN law and again under UN law we’ll have to agree management of these waters with the EU.
Like I keep saying it’s a complicated situation and the simplistic views of the leave camp were only ever fish pie in the sky.
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skybluetony176
Well-Known Member
IMF chief highlights recession risk of no-deal Brexit
Probably another biased loony frenchy but the IMF has just warned of a no deal brexit. Not that a smooth Brexit is going to be a bed of roses either according to the IMF.
Probably another biased loony frenchy but the IMF has just warned of a no deal brexit. Not that a smooth Brexit is going to be a bed of roses either according to the IMF.
Yes, but those are experts and obviously know nothing. Plus Juncker got Selmayr’s appointment through and we’ve got our fish back. So it’s going to be great after Brexit. And we’re getting blue passports. Stick that up your GDP!